Truck and Barter

Comments

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Sara Madgid wrote:

They already opened WTO talks with Iraq earlier, (this article from Dec 2004) and are trying to qualify it for WTO status, Michael.
Sara.
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WTO to Open Membership Talks With Iraq
World Trade Organization Gives Green Light for Iraqi Membership Talks
The Associated Press

GENEVA Dec 13, 2004 — The World Trade Organization decided Monday to open membership talks with Iraq.

The WTO's ruling General Council agreed by consensus to accept Iraq's application, trade officials said, thus starting the lengthy negotiations on terms for the country's joining the 148-nation organization that sets the rules for global commerce.

Iraqi Trade Minister Mohammed Mustafa al-Jibouri hailed the move, saying it was as significant as last month's decision by the Paris Club of creditor nations to write off 80 percent of Iraq's debts.

"We believe that these measures and other positive economic initiatives on the part of the international community will help bring stability and security to my country which had suffered a lot and still is," he told the General Council meeting

Iraq was granted observer status at the WTO in February a first step to gaining membership, giving it the right to attend meetings and hold some talks with WTO member countries.

It can now begin formal talks, which will likely last for years. To gain entry, prospective WTO members have to negotiate individual treaties with major trading partners and change laws and regulations to come into line with WTO rules.

"We believe that at this time, the accession process is far more important to us than the accession itself," said al-Jibouri, adding that it the possibility of membership would spur reform in Iraq.

"The new Iraq looks with great optimism at achieving political stability, economic prosperity and social development," he said. "We believe that our reintegration into the world trading system is an essential element to fulfill those aims."

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=325705&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

-- June 22, 2005 12:48 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Why are we in Iraq?
Even if we can't agree on what each of us thinks is the first motives..
I do think we can agree that the entire Iraqi endeavor has helped forestall this threat (below).
Imagine if GWB had done nothing and tried peaceful negotiations with the terorrists
(how reasonable are they proving themselves to be now at negotiating?).
Would they not have worked in the dark plotting an even greater 911..
this one with WMD or nukes from Saddam? Do you think France, Italy
or Canada would have been at risk for being their first target?
Sara.
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Experts warn of substantial risk of WMD attack
New survey predicts 70 percent chance of attack in next decade
MSNBC Updated: 6:22 a.m. ET June 22, 2005

WASHINGTON - There is a 70 percent risk of an attack somewhere in the world with a weapon of mass destruction in the next decade, arms experts predicted in a survey released on Tuesday.

They also said up to five more countries are likely to acquire nuclear weapons within the next 10 years.

The survey, conducted by U.S. Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman Richard Lugar, describes a threat that is “real and increasing over time” and endorses vastly increased funding for non-proliferation programs.

“Even if we succeed spectacularly at building democracy around the world, bringing stability to failed states and spreading economic opportunity broadly, we will not be secure from the actions of small, disaffected groups that acquire weapons of mass destruction,” the Indiana Republican said in a preface to the survey.

“Everything is at risk if we fail in this area,” he said.

A Lugar aide who oversaw the survey told Reuters 70 percent is “a very conservative estimate.”

An attack with a dirty bomb, combining a conventional explosive like dynamite with radioactive material, is seen as most likely, with a risk of 40 percent over the next decade.

The survey report also said “there was a broad agreement within the (experts’) group that nuclear weapons will proliferate to new countries in the coming years.”

Iran is pursuing a nuclear program that the United States and other nations believe is aimed at producing nuclear weapons. Iran insists its program is peaceful.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8312212/

-- June 22, 2005 1:09 PM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Thanks for information.

Does anyone else feel like a Dinaroholic? I got into this about 2 weeks ago and now I eat sleep and drink Dinars. There is a rumor forum over on another page involving Treasury Department Officials and Attorneys - this whole thing has my head spinning!

Yikes - all I think about is buy more Dinars, no dont buy more Dinars, yes buy more Dinars. My friends & coworkers think I am nuts!

-- June 22, 2005 1:18 PM ∞

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itroxell wrote:

Steps are falling into place...

Bank of Oklahoma is dealing in NID.

The contact is [Removed by K. Brancato for privacy reasons] and she advised that she can only place orders for or buy NID from Bank of Oklahoma account holders.

Just for info Bank of Oklahoma does their international trading with BofA.

Get ready for July!

[Editor's Note: My apologies for modifying this post, but please don't post private information unless you have permission!]

-- June 22, 2005 1:32 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

OKLAHOMA Exchanging Dinars

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Bank Of Oklahoma started yesterday, June 20th 2005., selling Dinars with a 15.00 cost added to the exchange rate. This is very good news!!!!!

I saw this posted on another mesage board and thought that this was really significant news for those that are holding Dinars. Iknow this time last year they would laugh you out of most any Internation bank if you asked them about IRAQ Dinars. if they are selling it today. I have to think they will buying it sometime in the near future. Yes as soon as it goes on the market. I see this as the bankers getting everything in place. Any thiughts on this and what it could mean??? :)) I am getting giddy here people. :))

[Editor's Note: This information has been disputed].

-- June 22, 2005 1:55 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

EXCITING NEWS!!! :)

The Central Bank of Iraq went offline with its currency exchange this morning. When it came back on, the rate was fixed at 1465.00 sell.

http://www.tbiraq.com/menafn_currencies_bl.asp

The speculation is that they will tightly control the rate going up now, perhaps in the thirty cent increments previously posted by Mark when he said, "they will raise the value .25 to .30 cents at a time"

http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html#11976

We may not have to wait til July..
It's lookin GOOD!! :)

Sara.

-- June 22, 2005 2:11 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Michael;
WTO and IMF are on the agenda.. :)
Sara.
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UN calls for faster progress on Iraq
22/06/2005

(MENAFN) In an opening statement to the international conference on Iraq, the UN's Secretary-general, called for "faster progress" on reconstruction development and humanitarian assistance, FT reported.

Representatives of more than 80 countries and organisations, including the US secretary of state, gathered at the conference in Brussels.

The event, co-sponsored by the European Union and the US, was first announced during President George W. Bush's February visit to Brussels. It is intended to be a signal both of strengthened transatlantic ties and increased international support for the Iraqi government that emerged after the country's democratic elections.

Iraq's foreign minister said the key message you'll hear is a call to share the burden and stabilise Iraq.

Iraqi government ministers will not be asking for donor funds - a donor conference is set to be held in Amman next month. But the minister said they would indicate their priorities and try to attract greater assistance in areas such as training of judges, prison wardens and police.

In fact, the EU agreed on a "rule of law mission" to carry out such tasks in February, with an aim of training about 770 officials over 12 months. The mission will be highlighted again today, since it is scheduled to become "operational" on July 1.

The EU has also provided substantial funding, collectively pledging $1.5 billion at the 2003 Madrid donor conference on Iraq, while the European Commission plans to open a representation in Baghdad.

The conference's final declaration is set to call on donors to step up their disbursements, for Iraq to develop ways to make such payments easier, and for countries that have not yet pledged support to rethink.

It is also likely to ask Iraq's other creditors to forgive the country's debts "on terms as least as generous" as debt relief granted by the Paris Club of creditor governments.

It is expected to call for support for Iraqi membership of the World Trade Organisation and to ask Baghdad and the International Monetary Fund to conclude a standby arrangement this year.

http://www.menafn.com/qn_news_story_s.asp?storyid=97005

-- June 22, 2005 3:03 PM ∞

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Capt'n wrote:

Sara,

Thanks for the info!

I confirmed this by calling the BoO office in Tulsa and they said it takes 3 days, $816 (cash) per mil.(today) + $15.00 fee. You do not have to be a customer of BoO and they can exchange them as well. It takes 2 weeks and a $10.00 fee. She told me there is no tax obligation(don't know her basis).

Sounds like very good news!

-- June 22, 2005 3:17 PM ∞

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Frankie wrote:

Hello,
REGARDING THE BANK OF OKLAHOMA
I called the Bank of Oklahoma and the number that was given on this forum and another forum. The lady, Beverly said that this information is FALSE. She is really upset that someone is giving out her number. I told her that I would post this message on this forum.

-- June 22, 2005 3:23 PM ∞

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Capt'n wrote:

Frankie...Wrong! It is REAL!

Here are the numbers that are on the B of O site and I called the Tulsa location!

Foreign Currency
405-272-2241 International Teller, OKC
918-588-6197 International Teller, Tulsa

-- June 22, 2005 3:42 PM ∞

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Investindinar wrote:

Dear All,

I just recently called HSBC to ask if they were going to trade in NID any time soon and the man on the other line responded very abruptly with a "NO" as if he knew something. What do you think of this? Also, when it is time to cash in do you think it is better to only do a portion or the whole amount? I know there will be a mad rush if the NID pegs at 0.42, but is it better to wait it out and see if the value of the dinar increases over time.

Waiting eagerly for your responses....

Investindinar

-- June 22, 2005 4:02 PM ∞

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Chromeman wrote:

Carl, I wanted to respond to your post last night, 21 June, but it got too late. What I will say now is I do agree with all your listings of Iraqi accomplishments for present and future.

The order in which they are accomplished remains unpredictable. On this I’m sure we agree. The reason for my posting now, in response to you ideas, is to add this thought.

I am not an economist and I am not saying my observances are factual but general. The Iraqi economy is in dyer need of reform. Subsidies in some areas have made competition impossible. The purchase power of the now dominant NID currency is too far below the needs of the people. Salaries have doubled for some professional people to keep them form moving out. In short, many preparations within the economy have been acted upon for the purpose of enabling a change in valuation, sorely needed.

I see your list of needed accomplishments drawing to fruition into the future. However, part of what the Iraqi people need, in order to accomplish this list, is more true value currency. I don’t see pegging as label for total success in Iraq. I do see incremental increases based on accomplishments from your list and more.

I hope I don’t get “torne up” too bad with this. It’s just my view and thoughts. I like to share a little, as apposed to only reading all your great posts. I think it’s time to start picking out some good travel sights. I think I hear a sound like a train coming down the track. It’s time to get that family trust in order.

Chromeman

-- June 22, 2005 4:18 PM ∞

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RON wrote:

Hello all
What great news we have been reading the last couple days.I see that IRAQ is in talks with WTO,this can be nothing but good.Yes I believe that sound we here could just be that wonderfull NID train.Hey terrance are you ready to pick up that drink and match.Good luck to all and IRAQ.
RON.
P.S.
Thanks again Kevin for the thread.

-- June 22, 2005 5:05 PM ∞

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RON wrote:

Hey NID gang I just called the lady at B of O and she said that it is an untruth what was posted on this thread.The B of O is not dealing in or with the NID.The person who posted that lie should be shamed of thier self for the damage to feelings of people they do and do not know.So please no more calls to this lady or bank.
RON

-- June 22, 2005 5:28 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Hi Gang,

I just wanted to relay that I just called the Bank of Oklahoma and spoke to Beverly. She was quite upset about the call and said that the Bank was definitly "Not" selling IQD. She also said that she was very upset that someone has given out her her name and telephone number on this website and hung up on me!

I tried to call the other numbers that "Capt'n" left for the Bank and it was after hours, so I couldn't verfy.

Outlaw in Iraq

-- June 22, 2005 5:28 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

So how does Capt explain all this. He says he spoke with the woman???

Frankie...Wrong! It is REAL!

Here are the numbers that are on the B of O site and I called the Tulsa location!

-- June 22, 2005 6:21 PM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Chromeman
No problem with your observation. I think that is good sound thinking.

-- June 22, 2005 7:00 PM ∞

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hank wrote:

hello gang,
I have been sitting in the background reading the post. I am like alot of yall, I believe that things are following in place. My biggest worry was if there was a peg at like .20 cents that the Iraq Government could not handle everyone cashing in at once. I later have read other post and used logic and if a bunch of people cashed in at .20 cents then someone would turn around and purchase the million (s) and hold on it until it reached another increment like .50 cent. I Believe we will see an incease in the Dinar soon. There are too many things happening and in the making. I also read Carl's post and understand his view but i believe Sara is on the right track when she said it will be "SOON" Any way, this is not my call, but I am looking for the Dinar to increase in 2006. So yall let's figure out where we going to have the party at, i suggest at Carl's place. LOL
Hank

-- June 22, 2005 10:16 PM ∞

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Millionaire2B wrote:

Dear Investindinar,
I have ordered many times from GID Associates and have gotten my NID within 3-5 days. I've also had no problem reaching them by phone. You can get 1 million NID for $780 + $19 shipping. I hope this helps. Thanks everyone for all the excellent info and Kevin B. for this great site.
Take care, M2B :)

-- June 22, 2005 11:19 PM ∞

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dae wrote:

I spoke with a rep of BoO this morning and they did confirm selling and buying the dinar. the number is 9185886197. Im not sure whats going on . . . but they told me that the rate was .000589 buy back, and .000816 sell. After reading the posts it doesnt add up.

-- June 23, 2005 12:08 AM ∞

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Frankie wrote:

ABOUT BANK OF OKLAHOMA

I CALLED THE OKLAHOMA CITY BRANCH THIS AFTERNOON.

They are not dealing with Iraqi dinar, either. I talked with the international teller there.
I tried to contact the Tulsa branch. I got a recording. I wasted long distance charges just checking this out. It looks like a dud to me.

-- June 23, 2005 12:14 AM ∞

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Investindinar wrote:

Dear All,

Quick question, if the dinar pegs in the next few weeks and we are able to go to HSBC and cash it in, do you have to have a receipt showing where you bought it and for how much? What I am saying is, won't they ask questions as to how we have (potentially) hundreds of thousands of dollars when we go to the bank?

Take Care

Investindinar

-- June 23, 2005 3:25 AM ∞

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Mark wrote:

Bob said Sara: I totally respect your opinion and narrative on why we are in Iraq, but you will have to admit that we stirred up a hornets nest in Iraq and brought terrorists and insurgents from several countries to Iraq to pursue their beliefs.

Bob, with the position I currently posses in Iraq, I can tell you your above statement is exactly what we are after. The terrorist are coming from countries that support terrorism from all over the Middle East and Africa. We have given them a place to fight and die for their beliefs here in Iraq, not on American soil. Very few of the current attacks are being portrayed by Iraqis. In fact, the terrorist are kidnapping Iraqis and using them as bate to get a loved one to be a suicide car bomber (VBIED) we have remains chained inside vehicles, feet taped to accelerator peddles and so on. We have killed tens of thousands of terrorist right
here. You see your opening statement argues against your point. I know situations like this are difficult and bring out strong emotion on both sides. Bottom line, there have not been any more incidents on American soil; Bin Laden has called for them recently and yet no action. This will in time change unfortunately, but for now we have brought the war to them.

-- June 23, 2005 6:45 AM ∞

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mark wrote:

Sterling, I have a great deal of knowledge of just what it took and still does to be a driver in IRAQ and in NO way was it a little part of this whole operation. I have not driven a truck over here myself, but was a fixture in the &&$ mission (SORRY I CANT GIVE THE REAL NAME) I know the exact body count you drivers reached, I know all the names of the fallen and many of the severly wounded. You have my up most respect for you courage. The American people do not have a clue as to the hazards you and the other drivers faced daily. Or the trillions...Not an exaggeration gallons of fuel moved up country. With out this nothing would have been possible. Thank you for your service in the theatre, Respectfully the former TR&&&OPS 1

PS, I hold the same respect for all the sections, not just the fuelers
Sara, keep it comming

-- June 23, 2005 8:04 AM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Millionaire2B,

Second your comment on GID Associates - smooth as silk. Received my order in 5 business days.

-- June 23, 2005 8:53 AM ∞

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just getting on the train wrote:

For the people who gave the bank and woman's name about the dinar: Did you ever think she was not suppose to release that info at this time and you may have jeopardized her job by mentioning her name. That's why when you call some people, they abrubtly say no. It is not suppose to be public yet. The woman probally thought her name would never be mentioned and look what confusion you have caused. Maybe even her job.

-- June 23, 2005 11:04 AM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

just getting on the train,

"Loose lips sink ships"

If she gave out her name and phone # and released confidential information to the general public she is either an idiot or a fool. If somebody else did it - shame on them.

-- June 23, 2005 11:12 AM ∞

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Jose wrote:

Chromeman, Exactly my main point earlier this week. The fact remains that the economy is Stalled, unemployment is about 60% and the dinars value is so low. How can Foreign investors came into this country with the way things are? The only way out is a change in the value of the currency to show the world and foreign investors that they can make a go of it. Any small adjustment to the currency rate would still make Iraqi exports attractive. Any one elses thoughs on this? Thanks,Jose

-- June 23, 2005 11:19 AM ∞

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STERLING wrote:

Mark,

thanks for your comments!! I went for selfish reasons, i went thru a divorce, ended up broke, needed quick money and some space. I left with a whole different view of the Iraqi situation. The Iraqi people deserve to be free as much as I do, they are no less as a people than we. The Iraqi's I met and worked with were very gratful for our being there and they were as scared for their safety as I was for mine. It was very humbling to have an old man, who looked to be around 70 to 75 y.o. show his gratitiude by trying to kiss my foot. I didn't drive a tanker while there, I moved military equip. by flat bed. Did some relief supply movement, briefly.

I made a call to a person I know personally in Tennessee who handles international funds ( no names or phone numbers )this morning. She told me to her knowledge no banks, including the one she works at, is allowed to deal in anyway with ID as of now. It's a restricted currency and can't be traded. I'm not saying this is right or wrong, simply stating what she said. She is a friend of my family and has been doing this for 15 years or so. I asume she has some level of expertise here???? She and I have had several conversations on this subject and she will let me know of any changes as they happen. Any info I get thru her I will post here promptly. Unfortunately I have no way of verifying whether it's right or wrong. I have a majic wand that can fix all this, but the batteries are down and I can't find the charger. Stupid fairy batteries!

-- June 23, 2005 12:59 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Last one on the list??

In this post:
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html#9753
It says in that article that, quote, " the Saudi government has killed or captured 25 out of the 26 leaders of Al-Qaeda that the government identified after Al-Qaeda launched its major offensive in Saudi Arabia in May 2003." This appears to be the news on the the last one on the list.
Sara.
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Website says top Saudi militant killed in Iraq
(Reuters)
23 June 2005

DUBAI - Iraq’s Al Qaeda group said on Thursday that a senior Saudi militant, wanted by Riyadh, has been killed in battles against US forces in Iraq, according to a statement posted on the Internet.

The group, led by Jordanian Abu Musab al Zarqawi, said Abdullah Mohammad al-Roshoud had been killed in fighting in Qaim in Iraq. He is one of three Saudi fugitives at large from a list of 26 senior Al Qaeda militants accused of carrying out a string of attacks in Saudi Arabia.

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/June/focusoniraq_June148.xml§ion=focusoniraq

-- June 23, 2005 1:09 PM ∞

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RYAN wrote:

this is old and ive read it there before, but have not read about it here
so my question would be why not peg after this is completed.... doesnt say completion date but says the firm selected will be anounced on JULY 15 2005
so however long it takes to do the audit i would think it would post after that maybe...any thoughts

Pursuant to the provisions of article (48) of the Banking Law No. 56 of 2004.

The Ministry of Finance invites all International Firms for Audits, desiring to audit the Central Bank of Iraq accounts, who have the experience in the field of Financial auditing of Central Banks and large International Financial Institutions, to submit their Offers in this regard, as follows :

1- Examine the Bank's accounts for 2004, audited by the Chamber of Supreme Audit, according to International Accounting Standards.

2- Audit and revise the Bank's accounts for 2005.

The closing date for receiving the offers will be 30/6/2005. The selected Firm will be informed on the 15th of July 2005.

3- Offers should be submitted to the Ministry of Finance – the Minister's Office.

Dr. Ali Abdul Ameer Alawi

Minister of Finance

http://www.cbiraq.org/cbs10.htm

-- June 23, 2005 1:31 PM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Calm before the storm!

-- June 23, 2005 1:41 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Carl;
I think your assessment, including chipmunks, appears rational and correct. :)
Sara.
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National Security Watch: Iraq insurgency vital to al Qaeda
Posted 6/22/05
By David E. Kaplan

How important is the Iraq insurgency to al Qaeda? It is now "the central battle" being waged by Osama bin Laden's terrorist network, according to a just-released report on al Qaeda's ideology by the Congressional Research Service. The study... notes that recent statements by al Qaeda Iraq chief Abu Musab Zarqawi and military leader Sayf al Adl both point to Iraq as an opportunity to spread their movement deeper into the heart of the Arab world.

With much of its leadership killed or captured and bin Laden thought to be hiding along the Pakistani border, al Qaeda is not the threat it once posed. But these latest missives from its leaders, taken together, suggest that the terrorist group behind 9/11 remains a worrisome threat. They appear designed to broaden their movement's appeal, gain material support, and "inspire new and more systematically devastating attacks," says the report, written by CRS Middle East analyst Christopher Blanchard.

The varied statements make up what the report calls "a sophisticated public relations and media campaign" over the past decade, one that has grown in importance in recent years. All told, they suggest that the movement's key goals remain unaltered and uncompromising, notes Blanchard: the expulsion of foreign forces and influences from Islamic lands, and the creation of a pan-Islamic state ruled by Koranic law.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/050622/22insurgency.htm?track=rss

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7 of 10 say Gitmo treatment not unfair
36% says detainees being treated 'better than they deserve'
Posted: June 22, 2005

A new poll reveals seven of 10 Americans believe the terror detainees at the Guantanamo Bay prison camp are being treated "better than they deserve" or "about right."

The poll conducted by Rasmussen Reports found 36 percent of respondents believe the prisoners are being treated "better than they deserve," while 34 percent said "about right."

Just 20 percent of Americans polled believed detainees have been treated unfairly.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44929

-- June 23, 2005 1:48 PM ∞

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RYAN wrote:

ok so maybe this has been brought up before but has anyone actually looked at the ratios of all these numbers that are floating around....like
peg .05, .10, .20, .33......
so if the dinar know is 1:1465
to get to .33 it would be 1us:3nid
i think even .01 is going to be a miracle that would be 1us:100nid...not to rain on any parades i want it to be at .33 for sure and that is when im exchangeing... does anyone have some charts or history of other curencies other than kuwait on the speed of curency recovery...i know that this situation is unique

-- June 23, 2005 5:22 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Leaders pledge support to Iraq
June 23, 2005
BY JEAN H. LEE
ASSOCIATED PRESS

BRUSSELS, Belgium -- Iraq won wide and concrete support from the international community at a conference that wrapped up Wednesday amid high hopes for the future of a country where the new government is struggling to cope with a relentless insurgency.

No new money was offered -- the meeting was never intended as a donors conference -- but among the steps to emerge were the scheduling of a fund-raising conference set for July 18-19 in Amman, Jordan; assurances from several nations to follow through on recent pledges of aid or to consider debt relief, and expert advice on drafting a constitution before the December elections.

"It's a good day for Iraq," Iraqi Foreign Minister Hoshyar Zebari said joyfully. An emotional UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan called it a watershed moment for the nation.

The one-day conference in Brussels, hosted by the European Union and the United States at Iraq's request, brought together more than 80 senior officials from around the world.

Iraq, led by Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari, asked governments to follow through with pledges of aid, to train Iraqi troops, and to restore full diplomatic relations as a sign of their commitment. "The Iraqi people don't forget those who stood by them during time of agony," he assured them.

Nations at the conference adopted a resolution promising full support of the Iraqi government's "efforts to achieve a democratic, pluralist, federal and unified Iraq."

http://www.freep.com/news/nw/iraq23e_20050623.htm

-- June 23, 2005 11:17 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Vice President Dick Cheney: Iraq will be 'enormous success story'
Thursday, June 23, 2005

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Vice President Dick Cheney on Thursday defended his recent comment that the Iraqi insurgency was in its "last throes," insisting that progress being made in setting up a new Iraqi government and establishing democracy there will indeed end the violence -- eventually.

However, in an exclusive interview with CNN's Wolf Blitzer, Cheney said he thinks there still will be "a lot of bloodshed" in the coming months, as the insurgents try to stop the move toward democracy in Iraq.

"If you look at what the dictionary says about throes, it can still be a violent period, the throes of a revolution," he said. "The point would be that the conflict will be intense, but it's intense because the terrorists understand that if we're successful at accomplishing our objective -- standing up a democracy in Iraq -- that that's a huge defeat for them.

"We will succeed in Iraq, just like we did in Afghanistan. We will stand up a new government under an Iraqi-drafted constitution. We will defeat that insurgency, and, in fact, it will be an enormous success story."

Cheney also said Bush administration officials "don't pay a lot of attention" to polls showing declining public support among Americans for the Iraq war.

"The last thing you want to do is to read the latest poll and then base policy on that," he said. "Presidents are generally ineffective if they spend all their time reading the polls and trying to make policy accordingly.

Cheney compared the current situation in Iraq to the last months of World War II, when Germans launched a desperate offensive in the Battle of the Bulge and the Japanese offered stiff resistance on Okinawa.

He said the insurgents will "do everything they can to disrupt" the process of building an Iraqi government, "but I think we're strong enough to defeat them."

"There will probably be a continued U.S. presence there for some considerable period of time, because there are some things we do they can't do -- for example, air support, some of our intelligence, communications and logistics capabilities," he said. "But I think the bulk of the effort will increasingly be taken on by Iraqi forces."

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/06/23/cheney.interview/index.html

-- June 23, 2005 11:33 PM ∞

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BOB wrote:

Carl, Sara, Mark, Michael and all of you who contribute to the T&B:

I believe that we are headed in the right direction, like with the price of oil at $60.00 BBL and the European community taking an active interest in the success of Iraq. Like I have said many times, security is the key. If we stop these idiots, we can succeed. If we continue to pamper them then they succeed. We need to eridicate all terrorists. If they have been to a terrorist school or if they have terrorist ties, then they should be given a chance to prove their innocence and if they can't, they should be killed.

The civilized world should not have to give up their way of life to placate terrorists. We are giving these terrorist the same benefit of the doubt as we do our U.S. killers, and the same humane treatment. Terrorists must be stopped and there is no humane way to do it.

Mr. Bush got us into this situation, and I am trusting him to get us out with some degree of success, and therein lies the hope of success of the Dinar. As I have said before, Mr. Bush in dedicated to insuring the stability of Iraq and is willing commit any amount of U.S. dollars. So, it is matter of time until all these thing come together and the Dinar starts to move upward.

I am planning to get one of the first slices of the pig at Maui.

-- June 23, 2005 11:33 PM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Bob!
I agree a lot of what you said, however, I do not believe GWB got us into anything.
GWB has done what he was supposed to do as a leader of a nation. Be strong, be vigilant toward your nation and the world. View things as they are, not as you want them to be and act accordingly.

The United Nations had issued so many decrees and warnings against Saddam, for non-compliance that he only laughed. Its like some of school officials here in the USA, telling a unruly student to sit down or I will put you name on the board, and go tell the principal.Its about time, we had a strong school leader who said, enough is enough. Watch me! Follow me! I am going to start taking our schools back.
Words without true meaning are like vapors of mist, barely seen and rarely felt.
Saddam knew unless, GWB had bigger ones than ole Teflon Bill Clinton, he was going to do just what he wanted to do, cause he knew, he had France, Russia, Germany, and 100 other small tick (bloodsuckers) nations in his pocket because of the oil bribes.
Well! Guess What!!!
When George Walker Bush told ya you are in for a Ass Whupping, ya better start looking for some padding.
George W did what every leader should have been doing before he was given the wheel of the ship. Put steel in your words, say what you mean with clarity, and mean what you say with action and resolve. Let your words have strength, character, and direct meaning without having to have a interpretor of political gibbish to understand them.
No! I don't believe George W put us anywhere. It was the incompetence, the dishonesty, the running of the spineless pack of UN leaders and the world Leaders who stopped and said, HUH! WHAT! YOU CAN'T DO THAT! WE HAVEN'T BACKED UP OUR WORDS IN YEARS! WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE? YOU ARE UPSETTING THE APPLE CART HERE! HOW DARE YOU TO STAND BEHIND YOUR WORDS, AND ACT LIKE A LEADER! YOU ARE STARTING TO MAKE US LOOK BAD!
Because of GWB, we have thousands of iraqi's alive that would now be dead.
I remember looking at a website showing saddam's henchmen wiring two men up with explosives. These men had their hands tied behind them. Once wired, it showed the soldiers force the men down in the hole. The next thing you saw was a spray of dirt, body parts and blood being blown upward from the hole. Then soldiers laughing.
Yep! Senators like dubin, kennedy, dennis the spinach, are spineless, waffling parrots, who have no clue as to how to lead anything, except a group of old men with excited minds and limp members in their hands to the whore house.
Thank God for a man who says what he means.
Thank God for a man who has the strength and resolve to back up what our nation stands for.
Thank God for America, who sometimes is slow to anger and act, but when shoved too far will put a boot up your ass, and open a #10 can of whoop Ass with her teeth for ya to eat.

-- June 24, 2005 9:11 AM ∞

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peter wrote:

Wilson,

Well done I must appreciate what you write. I am fully agreed with you. and happy with GWB leadership qualities. Really he is great leader. he did according to suitation.

Peter

-- June 24, 2005 10:02 AM ∞

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Chad Nowers wrote:

Carl I sure do like the way you think

-- June 24, 2005 10:34 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Playing Ostrich..

The War in Iraq is very integrally tied to the fortunes of the Dinar. If the war succeeds, the country and the Dinar succeed. So I want to put in my two cents worth on HOW to win a war.. simple, common sense words, these. However, it is a lack of this clarity of thought that seems to be putting our forces at risk. So, for what it is worth, my thoughts on the war and what we need to do to win... for the US, for Iraq, and for the Dinar. :)

When GWB took the Whitehouse for a second term, they ridiculed him for putting in people with the same vision and team spirit, calling them "yes men" (and women). However, in the movie "Remember the Titans" the team never won against their enemies as long as the issue of race divided them. Anyone not working for the team (black or white) was eliminated in order that they could focus on the goal of winning, together. All dissenters who could not work within the team and for the team were removed from participating. This was the strategy, and, in history, they won. War is a similar thing. When a country is at peace, the checks and balances of opposing views allow us to use the constructive criticism to learn where we are weak and improve ourselves. In war, it only tears down and gives the advantage to the opposing forces. Division and bickering between ourselves is a sure path to defeat.

When House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif. said, "The president wanted to go to Iraq in the worst possible way and he did," Pelosi said. "The president is on the ropes." This is not constructive and team building. It does not help in the war, which should be the focus of the country until we are at peace again. The reply by Karl Rove:

Rove, Bush's chief political adviser, said in a speech Wednesday that "liberals saw the savagery of the 9/11 attacks and wanted to prepare indictments and offer therapy and understanding for our attackers." Conservatives, he told the New York state Conservative Party just a few miles north of Ground Zero, "saw the savagery of 9/11 and the attacks and prepared for war."
Rove said the Democratic Party made the mistake of calling for "moderation and restraint" after the terrorist attacks.

Quotes from: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160495,00.html

I don't think Mr. Rove needs to apologise for these sentiments. It is obvious to anyone on the front lines that the dissenting politicians back home are weakening support for them and their mission and putting their lives more at risk. It is not being "yes men" to be a team player and offer support to the team called America. Politicians who call themselves Americans should be AMERICAN first, and part of their party second. They should be putting the lives of the American servicemen and women first before their own political advancement and criticism of the present Administration. They should put their own careers on hold and advance the interests and security of the nation instead, until we win this war. Unless we move together united, we will be defeated. Our enemies are not babies and none of us are Supermen. But united, we will take the goal. We will win. Can somebody get that idea through the skulls of those who think they are "pawns of Washington propaganda" if they so much as say we SHOULD be fighting terrorism? These people would prefer we wait until they annihilate us by the Millions? Are these dissenters so foolish as to believe that we can peacefully negotiate with the terrorists? (If so, how about we send THEM out to do negotiations with them RIGHT NOW? It would save time.. ) Do they truly believe that now, if we remove our forces from Iraq, the threat that the terrorists pose will just "go away"?

Sara.

-- June 24, 2005 10:36 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Could tearing down ever be.. Treason??

Here is some interesting information and an excellent example of tearing down.
Ted Kennedy who quote, 'slammed the military effort as ”consistently grossly mismanaged,”
and called on Rumsfeld to resign.' (below, last sentence)
Now THAT is real team spirit, isn't it?
You can bet that this kind of sentiment just encourages America's men and women in uniform fighting for freedom in Iraq...
wouldn't you think?

For those who insist on ridiculing and tearing down... Does anyone of them know the definition of the word TREASON?
For the record, on Dictionary.com.. it is this:
1 -"Violation of allegiance toward one's country or sovereign, especially the betrayal of one's country by waging war against it or by consciously and purposely acting to aid its enemies."
2 - "the offense of attempting to overthrow the government of one's country or of assisting its enemiÕÈÛ¿ù·¢r; specifically : the act of levying war against the United States or adhering to or giving aid and comfort to its enemies by one who owes it allegiance."
3 - "a crime that undermines the offender's government"
4 - "disloyalty by virtue of subversive behavior"

Could any of those apply here?
Sara.
--
Iraqi PM meets with Bush to plan for future of Iraqi transition
(AFP)
24 June 2005

WASHINGTON - Iraqi Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari prepared on Friday to hold talks with US President George W. Bush on his nation’s troubled transition process, in which US troops will continue to play a pivotal role.

Jaafari told the Council on Foreign Relations think tank here Thursday that while terrorism remained a major threat in Iraq, US and Iraqi forces had made some headway against the insurgents.

He said thousands of terrorists had been jailed since Iraq’s transitional government took power in March, and the number of car bombings had fallen from 12 to 14 a day to less than one.

“The general trend is very much a downward,” he said.

“Previously, people used to avoid going out but now they stay out very late at night, so there has been a qualitative improvement in the security situation.”

His comments came as top Bush administration officials launched a public relations offensive to defend the war, insisting US soldiers were winning the conflict and rejecting calls for a timetable for withdrawal.

In an interview with The Washington Post, Jaafari said it would be a serious mistake to establish a deadline for US troop withdrawal.

“We would like to see the withdrawal of American forces as quickly as possible, because the presence of any foreign troops on our land means there is a weakness that we cannot by ourselves control the security situation,” Jaafari said.

But a deadline would “play into the hands of the terrorists,” he added.

“We strongly prefer an increase in quality of Iraqi forces, increase in number, increase in efficiency, increase in the effectiveness of tactics they use, as well as increase in equipment ... because it will allow other forces, especially American forces, to withdraw.”

The Iraqi leader on Thursday paid tribute to more than 1,700 US troops who have died in Iraq since the 2003 invasion to oust Saddam Hussein.

“We acknowledge that the blood of your sons has mixed with the blood of our sons and paid a very high price and sacrifice to bring about democracy and freedom,” he told the council.

That toll is likely to rise further. On Thursday, US General John Abizaid, who heads the US Central Command, conceded that there was still “a lot of work to be done” to break the resolve of a resilient insurgency, with more foreign fighters coming into Iraq than six months ago.

A US military official in Baghdad said Friday that rebels attacks in the capital would likely rise over the coming weeks.

However, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld struck back at war critics. “Any who say that we’ve lost this war, or that we’re losing this war, are wrong. We are not,” he told a Senate Armed Services Committee hearing Thursday.

He said that setting a timetable, which some US lawmakers, including fellow Republicans, have called for, “would throw a lifeline to terrorists.”

Meanwhile, in an interview with CNN, Vice President Dick Cheney offered a pugnacious defense of the war effort, refusing to withdraw a remark last month that the insurgency was in its “last throes.”

“If you look at what the dictionary says about throes, it can still be a, you know, a violent period, the throes of a revolution,” Cheney said.

“The point would be that the conflict will be intense, but it’s intense because the terrorists understand if we’re successful at accomplishing our objective, standing up a democracy in Iraq, that that’s a huge defeat for them.”

A New York Times/CBS News poll last week showed 59 percent disapproval of how Bush was handling Iraq, the president’s worst rating since the war began, and emboldened Democrats are increasingly vocal.

Democratic Senator Ted Kennedy, one of Congress’s most vociferous Iraq war critics, slammed the military effort as ”consistently grossly mismanaged,” and called on Rumsfeld to resign.

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/June/focusoniraq_June155.xml§ion=focusoniraq

-- June 24, 2005 11:10 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

That second definition was:

2 - "the offense of attempting to overthrow the government of one's country or of assisting its enemies in war; specifically : the act of levying war against the United States or adhering to or giving aid and comfort to its enemies by one who owes it allegiance."

It got garbled in transmission over the net..

As we watch good American soldiers fight and sacrifice in this war, it is something to think about.. the possibility these deconstructionist detractors could be bordering on treason, I mean.

Sara.

-- June 24, 2005 12:54 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

I think Ol Merle said it best. I also think a lot of the younger generation could learn a few things about loyalty and character sometimes. I know Ted Kennedy needs a lesson. I say he needs to resign his post. GO GW....Go IRAQ!!

I hear people talking bad
About the way they have to live here in this country
Harping on the wars we fight
Griping about the way things ought to be
I don't mind them switching sides
And standing up for things they believe in
When they're running down our country man
They're walking on the fighting side of me

I read about some squirrely guy
who claims that he just don't believe in fighting
And I wonder just how long
The rest of us can count on being free
They love our milk and honey
But they preach about some other way of living
And when they're running down our country man
They're walking on the fightin' side of me

-- June 24, 2005 1:50 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Iraq's neighbours pledge to end isolation

BRUSSELS (AP) — Iraq will begin restoring full diplomatic relations with Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, officials said, ending more than a decade of frozen ties with its Arab neighbours.
Many Arab countries withdrew their ambassadors from Iraq shortly after Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait in 1990, causing a deep rift between Iraq and its neighbours.

Iraqi Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari, speaking Wednesday at an international conference on his country, urged countries to upgrade their ties with Iraq.

"Open your embassies in Baghdad," Jaafari said.

Iraqi Foreign Minister Hoshiyar Zebari announced that Egypt would be the first Arab country to upgrade its diplomatic representation by appointing a full-fledged ambassador.

The conference, co-hosted by the European Union and the United States, endorsed Iraq's new government's reform plans.

Zebari, in his address, praised Egypt for "showing regional leadership by taking the decision to appoint the first Arab ambassador we hope to soon welcome in the new Iraq." Ihab Sherif, Egypt's newly appointed envoy to Iraq, arrived in Baghdad on June 1. It's not clear if Sherif will be upgraded to ambassador.

Egypt withdrew its ambassador in 1991 when it backed the US-led alliance against Saddam, after he invaded Kuwait.

In 1996, Egypt restored trade ties when the United Nations started its oil-for-food programme. Following the US-led war on Iraq in 2003, Egypt, like many Arab countries, sent an envoy and small mission to look after Egyptian workers in Iraq.

Zebari said he was also hopeful full diplomatic ties could be restored with both Saudi Arabia and Kuwait. He described relations with them as being "good and very positive." He added that Iraq asked the two countries to forgive some or all of Iraq's debts and readdress compensation for victims of Iraq's 1990 invasion of Kuwait.

"The Iraqi people are not responsible for the mistakes of Saddam," he told the Associated Press on Tuesday.

Jaafari told reporters that the secretary general of the Arab League, Amr Musa, will visit Iraq at the end of the month. Musa was a fierce critic of Washington's decision to oust Saddam and has demanded quick withdrawal of foreign troops from Iraq.

The Iraqi premier also said the Arab League will reopen its mission in Baghdad and send a group of Arab experts to help draft the constitution.

Also at the conference, Jordanian Foreign Minister Farouq Qasrawi announced: "We will be sending our new ambassador to Iraq very soon." No date has been given on the return of Jordan's ambassador to Iraq.

Jordan's embassy in Baghdad was targeted in August 2003 by a car bomb that killed 19 people. Following that attack, Iraqis stormed the Jordanian embassy and raised an Iraqi flag on its roof.

In Ottawa, Canada's foreign ministry announced it was naming its ambassador to Jordan to also take up the job in Baghdad. Spain was to send a new ambassador to Iraq soon, officials said.

Friday-Saturday, June 24-25, 2005

http://www.jordantimes.com/fri/news/news2.htm

-- June 24, 2005 3:33 PM ∞

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lookout wrote:

WARNING TO PEOPLE JB.TRADER IS BACK!!!
The scum who ripped us off last year on ebay is now online again ..or did he even leave???

Here is KNOWN websites for him because i spoke to his brother last year while he was honeymooning in Alaska on MY MONEY!I spoke to both several times so know the voice
He was usdinars ,kind-hearts and many others.He has something to do with GID INVESTMENTS because i called that number last year and SAMIR TAYEH answered.

Here is his website www.dinarmerchant.com ,www.usdinar.com and www.dinarssales.com

I suspect he may be safedinar with a feedback of 1 .Keep out for him for sure !

-- June 24, 2005 4:17 PM ∞

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dae wrote:

Hey LOOKOUT,

I recently bought from dinarmerchant.com. How did he rip you off? Were the bills counterfeit, or did you just never receive your dinar?

-- June 24, 2005 6:41 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

U.N. Approves $200M for Iraq Development
By EDITH M. LEDERER, Associated Press Writer
June 24, 2005

UNITED NATIONS - The U.N. Security Council on Friday approved the transfer of $200 million in oil-for-food revenue to the Development Fund for Iraq and said an additional $20 million can be used to pay Iraq's past U.N. dues.

Iraq has been lobbying the council for months to stop using the country's oil revenue to pay compensation to victims of the 1991 Gulf War and the salaries of U.N. weapons inspectors — and to transfer all money remaining in the U.N.'s oil-for-food accounts to the development fund.

Earlier this week, Secretary-General Kofi Annan proposed transferring part of the $345.9 million that was in the account at the start of the year to fund U.N. weapons inspectors who had the task of dismantling Iraq's nuclear, chemical, biological, and long-range missile programs.

Annan proposed transferring $200 million to the Development Fund and using $20.3 million to pay Iraq's outstanding U.N. dues.

That would leave more than $125 million to pay for continuing activities of the U.N. Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission known as UNMOVIC.

France's U.N. Ambassador Jean-Marc de La Sabliere, the current president of the 15-nation council, said he has drafted a reply approving the secretary-general's proposal. Nobody objected, so the letter of approval will be sent.

"This is an Iraqi initiative," Iraq's acting ambassador Mohammed Al-Humaimidi said. "Of course, we are happy about it. ... It is our money."

But Al-Humaimidi said Baghdad won't be satisfied until all of the money in the escrow account is transferred to the development fund.

Iraq's U.N. Ambassador Samir Sumaidaie has been arguing that Iraq does not pose a threat and does not possess any weapons of mass destruction, and therefore it is a waste of money to spend more than $10 million a year on UNMOVIC.

"This is the Iraqi people's money," said Richard Grenell, spokesman for the U.S. Mission to the United Nations. "We welcome the council's decision to give the money back to them, and now the newly elected government can decide how best to spend it."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050624/ap_on_re_mi_ea/un_iraq

-- June 24, 2005 7:40 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

A Couple of Opinions on the War in Iraq..

USA TODAY's editorial “Americans deserve candor, not more hopeful ‘updates' ” draws the wrong conclusions and places blame on the wrong shoulders.

For example, the editorial notes that almost six in 10 Americans want some or all troops to come home. Yet the same editorial argues that there is no choice but to stay the course.

If USA TODAY believes that argument, where is its news coverage presenting the information to the American people that supports staying the course? The poll results indicate that the news media aren't providing that coverage.

Furthermore, USA TODAY states that reports from Iraq suggest that forces are stretched too thin to overwhelm the insurgency. Yet, (they admit) military commanders are constantly asked whether they have the right resources to do the job and are given those resources. The commanders know, as should USA TODAY, that the path to success is not through an occupation force, but rather a liberation force.

USA TODAY asks, “When will Iraqis be able to take over?” Most newly independent countries take some time to stand fully on their own. The truth is, the Iraqis are taking over more each day.

Finally, the editorial criticizes updates as lacking a hard assessment of the realities on the ground. Yet on the same day, USA TODAY carried an article regarding Vietnam War veterans serving in Iraq, in which one noted, “There's no doubt in my mind that this was the right thing to do.”

The reality is that a transitional government has been elected, a new constitution is being written, and dozens of Iraqi battalions are effective.

Christopher J. Smalley

West Chester, Pa.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050624/letlead24.art.htm

Good news spurs support for war effort

As a veteran of the Vietnam War myself, I appreciated the article on warriors from the Southeast Asian conflict serving in Iraq (“Vietnam Vets in Iraq see ‘entirely different war',” Cover story, News, Tuesday).

What most caught my attention was these veterans' observation that the American public's support is one of the major things that makes a difference today.

I think we can thank cable television and the Internet for that. If we were stuck with just the three major networks spewing anti-war rhetoric, as I believe they did back in the late 1960s and early 1970s, the attitude of our citizens might be just as it was about the conflict in Vietnam.

However, when I can log onto my computer and find out all the good that our troops are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan, it reassures me of the goodness of America.

James V. Kelso III

Peachtree City, Ga.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050624/letfeat24.art.htm

-- June 24, 2005 9:50 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

I was reading about how insurgents are getting paid to do the bombings in this article:

U.S. General: Many Insurgents in Iraq Paid
By JOHN J. LUMPKIN,
Associated Press Writer
Jun 21,12:32 PM ET

Many insurgents conducting attacks in Iraq are primarily motivated by money instead of ideology, and can receive $150 for setting a bomb and more for other types of assaults, a top U.S. general asserted Tuesday.

The general said that some simple attacks, such as placing a bomb or mine, are performed for as little as $100 or $150. Speaking to reporters at the Pentagon via teleconference from Iraq, Vines cited interviews with captured detainees.

"So we believe that this insurgency is driven in large measure by money," Vines said, suggesting the ideological supporters of the insurgency are funding the attacks. Some bombings are worth hundreds of dollars or more, he said.

He suggested that even some suicide bombings are motivated by money, but provided little detail.

"I mean, how much do you pay someone who's going to murder some other people when they kill themselves?" he said.

He did not say where the money for the attacks was coming from.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050621/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_iraq_insurgency_2&printer%3D1%3B_ylt%3DAmh2RlRGB9iLNXB8z9B04ESWwvIE%3B_ylu%3DX3oDMTA3MXN1bHE0BHNlYwN0bWE-

It occurs to me that the motivation may be this. Supposing a person is dying.. say of Cancer or of Aids... they might be thinking that they are going to die anyways, so why not get a martyrdom degree (which they believe is instant admission into heaven) and leave some money for the family while you are at it? I think this "terrorism industry" is a good insurance policy to leave behind their loved ones quite well provided for. Better than just dying of Aids as a nobody, at least someone knew they lived.. all those bereaved by those they killed (and they make the newspaper headlines the world over, a little fame). As a possible bonus to them, they might put a smile on those bloodthirsty souls who eagerly attach the bombs to their bodies. Beats dying of disease quietly and decently as normal people do, and their families might just endorse it and pat them on the back for being good Muslims (and providing for them financially).

"The Love of Money is the root of all evil."

It's called exploiting the poor, the needy and the sick.. and I don't think the insurgents are above that, do you?

Sara.

-- June 24, 2005 10:15 PM ∞

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Johnny Cash wrote:

I was in the Baghdad Airport the other day... A Coke was 1 USD. I asked the vender if he took Dinar and of corse he did... The same Coke was 1,000 IQD.

That basically puts the Dinar at .001 for an exchange at the airport.

I visited several locations surrounding Iraq and asked to exchange Iraqi Dinar. None of the currency exchanges I found would do so.

The global "Peg" has already happened... It's 1465 and you all know where to check it daily because that's all you can think about!!!

What everyone needs to pray for is not a "Peg" but "Acceptance." "Global Acceptance."

Until then, all that anyone with an Iraqi Dinar investment can do is sell it on EBay or fly to Baghdad and buy a Coke for a little less...

The Airport continues to be a wreck even though it's the first thing you see when you arrive, and last thing you see when you leave! It needs paint, carpet, electronics and a lot more.

It's coming along, but there is a long way to go.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I think this message board is filled with sources that "Sell" Dinar and start rumors to stir everyone up!

Iraq needs a constitution and it took America seven years to develop one. Until then, I promise you will have nothing!

Understand, I am watching the microeconomics of Iraq and I have Dinar, however a jump to .30 cents is impossible! ! ! I want it to happen as much as all of you, but... this is a long haul.
If you couldn't afford to loose it, you shouldn't have bought it. Before it ever gets to twenty cents, the 25K and 10K notes will be history!

Anyone, name me a country that has a denomination (dollar bill) worth 5K USD that is traded globally and I will stand corrected.

The Dinar is gaining strength BUT,
You are all out of control and should get back to work! J.P. Barnum would love you in his crowd!

-- June 25, 2005 2:45 AM ∞

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PeterP wrote:

Just a note and a suggestion please...
the reason these threads get so bloody long and page takes so long to load as in last thread
is that some individuals copy entire news articles
and post (as last post)

It would benefit, and also be considerate and courteous
to both K Brancato(Mod) T & B and all the contributors
and readers of T & B, if just the link w/ a brief comment was posted related to the Dinar discussion only (*remember copyrights)

Thank you for your consideration
Peter P

-- June 25, 2005 10:26 AM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Ryan,

I was just catching up on my reading and ran across you post. I thought I'd throw my two cents towards you... Iraq IS different than most other countries, in the aspect that most other countries did not have the entire free world standing within their borders throwing money at them trying to rebuild the entire country, as being done here in Iraq.

I am presently here in Iraq. I've seen both sides of the coin...some people are stating that the reason that the Dinar was at .33/1 prior to the invasion was simply because Saddam set the rate. Others say that the present and future GDP of a country is the sole deciding factor along with reliability of paying its debits. I think that one needs to look at what the IMF uses to determine rate establisization. I don't think Saddam had as much power determining what the Dinar used to be worth, as GWB has on determining what the USD is worth today. For that being said... I can't see the Dinar opening for any amount less than what it was worth under Saddam for two reasons. First, of all the .33USD/1IQD rate was because of 12 years of UN sanctions and an extreamly high debt ratio. and secondly, the free world is trying to promote Democracy in the Middle East...how would it look to the Iraqis and their neighbors if the IQD is worth less now than what it was under Saddam? I belive that we're all going to be laughing and singing together at that pig roast on the beach! Go Dinar!!!

Outlaw in Iraq.

-- June 25, 2005 2:10 PM ∞

---

Jimmy P wrote:

List Of Good Sellers
In Response To comment by "Lookout" of June 24,05...
I am still buying more tickets to "The Train", and I am interested to learn more about peoples bad experiences. Can we assemble a "Positive" list of
Dinar Brokers that buyers have had multiple good
transactions with? This will help us promote the good guys over the others. Hoo Rah

-- June 25, 2005 2:16 PM ∞

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Investindinar wrote:

Dear Johnny Cash,

While I appreciate the honesty and realistic tone of your post, I would just like to comment on the high denomination bills.

You are right that there is no currency in the world that has 5K USD Value bills in circulation. In fact I beleive that the highest bill in circulation is the Swiss $500 dollar bill (worth about $400USD). However banks use larger bills for doing transactions between other banks. While these notes are too large to use in regular circulation they are LEGAL TENDER, and if you were to have one you could cash it into a bank account.

The same will happen in Iraq (if the value increases). They may stop printing 25K, 10K, 5K and 1K bills, but it does not mean that they will lose their value. Instead the bank will simply collect them when people cash them in. Given several weeks or months of people cashing in their dinar (or depositing it into accounts) there will be no more high denomination bills in circulation. Instead when Iraqi's go to ATM's to withdraw money they will get smaller bills from the machines. The banks however will keep the high denomination bills for their own use.

My point being that even if the high denomination bills do 'become history' in terms being printed and circulated, they will remain legal tender and we will still be able to cash them in.

Take care and good luck to all next month!!

-- June 25, 2005 4:00 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Johnny,

I hope you did the smart thing this time and bought that coke with the Dinar instead of the green back??? (hehe) Also, lets put things "back" into perspective... How much does that same coke cost you at the Charles De Gaulle Airport? or JFK? All Airports rip you off my friend not just BIAP!

Outlaw

-- June 25, 2005 5:30 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Oh Johnny?... one other thing...that same coke will only cost you 100 Dinar at the market in downtown Baghdad. I am told that is the average cost every where else in Iraq now. :)

Outlaw

-- June 25, 2005 5:38 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Johnny Boy!! Do you thjink that the world has taken maybe a few steps towards progression since America wrote thier constitution?? LOL

With all the help that IRAQ has I would bet that they could have it written in a few hours if they really wanted to.

Have some faith son! Be Positive.

Dream BIG!

Live BIG!!

Go IRAQ!!

-- June 25, 2005 5:52 PM ∞

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lookout wrote:

To the person who bought from dinarmerchant.com

http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback&userid=jb.trader

here is why you can be concerned ,he was known as the best or at least top 2 on ebay for a long time then look at all the people he ripped off.

I still got all my waybills from when he did send to me and reminded of the thousands he didn't.They are from Jordan and must rack up the frequent flier miles making trips to Chicago and other us cities.There is a gang of them involved here ,almost as bad as the nigerias with their millions stuck in a trunk. Do yourself a favor dont trust them and Another buyer of his said his bills were conterfeit , not sure if it is true or not.Would hope not because i still have 3 million here.

-- June 25, 2005 11:48 PM ∞

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okie wrote:

We were informed on Friday that BIAP (Baghdad International Airport) was closing for an indefinite period of time. We will now use Kuwait to get to Dubai for R&R, etc. Anybody have any info. on this situation. We heard a rumor it was because the security company for the airport went on strike. A friend of mine just came into the office and he said they were still on the job because he saw them at the airport on Friday. Many rumors....need facts.

-- June 26, 2005 1:08 AM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

THINGS SAID

Beware lest in your anxiety to avoid war
for in the end you may gain a master
(Demosthenes)

For those who think ending a war is the best of all outcomes. I have found the quickest way I know to end a war is to lose it.
(George Orwell)

The Person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nor nothing more important than their personal safety, is a miserable creature. They have not a chance of remaining free unless protected by the exertions of better men.
(John Mill)

In modern war you will die like a dog for "no good reason"
(Ernest Hemingway about WWII when hitler was destroying nations and killing millions)

To my mind to kill in war is no better than murder.
(Albert Einstein, who fled Hitler before he really started his killing rampage)

Maybe someday they will give a war and nobody will care to come.
(Carl Sandburg)

For the fools who think that problems in war arise from lack of planning or leadership, allow me to address you. Never! Never! Believe war is smooth and easy. The statesman who yields to war fever must realize, once the signal is given, he is no longer the master of policy, but a slave of unforeseeable and uncontrollable events.
(Winston Churchill)

Classified leaks by senators,senators and media elites criticizing the president in public, retired flag grade officers providing insight on how they might see forces deployed for combat. All done under the banner of "Free Expression"
Balkan and Mid East Cultures have no respect for vacillation, such as displayed by the above.
During war you have fog and friction. If the fog is lifted just a little by irresponsible leaders, then our enemy has been given a better advantage.
If our senators, and media give the enemy a reason to fight on, and instill in their forces, that they can win, then they have given, them the additional will to fight, at the cost of our mens lives.
One of the greatest generals of China, Gen Sun Tzu's press corp did not exist. He considered them spy's and treated them accordingly.
(A Gunnery Sergeant, US Marine Corp)

-- June 26, 2005 9:38 AM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Okie,

BIAP has re-opened...should resume full operations on 06/27/05 at 0700... Don't sweat it.

Outlaw

-- June 26, 2005 11:36 AM ∞

---

Lila wrote:

Carl,

I loved your earlier post about GWB and would like to know if I could have permission to e-mail to my brother. I don't know where it will go from there but I really think you stated his case well and would love to share it.
Thanks, Lila

-- June 26, 2005 5:11 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

I agree 100% with Lila...

Carl... Great post for GWB!... No matter if your a Democrat or a Republican... An American must act like an American!

"A true American speaks out for a true American!"

HoooooRah!

Outlaw

-- June 26, 2005 9:41 PM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Lila:
I have no problem with you using anything I have written. Thank you for your kind words.

-- June 26, 2005 11:13 PM ∞

---

jeff wrote:

Ive had a great experience with Dima 89 on ebay buying dinars. Ive bought over 12 mill for myself and friends and family through him and have not had a bad experience.Go dinars

-- June 27, 2005 12:39 AM ∞

---

Bryan the A/C guy wrote:

Hi all

-- June 27, 2005 6:54 AM ∞

---

Carl wrote:

UNITY IS DEMANDED
Many things during times of conflict are important. The one at the top of the list is UNITY. Even more than SIZE (Hey! guys! remember when you were little and your mother gave you a bath. She always patted your back and said, its ok! Sweetheart, size doesn't matter) or even WEALTH.
We in the USA are only as powerful as our strength in UNITY and commitment to the conflict. UNITY requires three things. (1)Same Philosophy or like mind to move toward the same shared goal.(2) Same unison and purpose within the Command Structure (3)Utilizing a system that works together in moving equipment and personel to the conflict in order to achieve the goal.
Just as in Vietnam, the danger in Iraq is the division of the American People over the conduct of the Conflict. History has shown us long conflicts tend to create division among all classes and economic positions of any race, or any nation.

But what do you consider a long term conflict? Look at WW1, WW2,Civil War,Vietnam, these are wars just in our immediate history of 150 years. When you compare how long we have been in Iraq to these, the conflict is barely underway.
Even Rumsfield, stated, yesterday, it may take the Iraq Government as long as 12 years to end the insurgency totally. It seems the American people today are so use to the 60 sec commercial or high leveraged credit card, so they can get what they think will make them happy instantly, the thought of long commitments to a project or conflict are no longer considered, and out of the realm of their reality.

Divisions within a nation do not occur over night. In order to stop the division over Iraq from continuing, President Bush must be more articulate about what we are achieving in Iraq. It is not enough to say it is hard work birthing democracy.
I like George W, but when it comes to explaining his policies on Iraq, and his personal vision for Iraq on a continuous bases, his articulation skills are not at max.
American people seem to have short term memories. Maybe that is why... Let me drive ya home Ted Kennedy, Dennis the Spinach, Senator (Can I have some salt with my foot) Durbin, and down on your knees Bill Clinton kept and keep getting re-elected.
The President must get it over to the citizens of this country, progress is not a cessation of terrorist attacks. He must get it over and into the minds of the people, that conflicts never end. They just become new challenges, and new goals once the shooting stops. Conflicts are more than bloodshed.
You can be ya pet chicken, that as long as the insurgency continues to get the media to focus on them, they will continue the bombings.
Progress in Iraq should be measured by changes within the political system,economic advances in the country, and its improved relationships with surrounding neighbors.
But these are not good front page attactions which increase publications, and profits. People in general have a carwreck mentality. They want to see or talk about blood and carnage. Don't believe me...then why do so many people rubber neck at a auto accident.
President Bush and his team have got to get the Iraqi achievements out there. Increased standard of living, working toward increase oil production so oil prices can go down, constitution being written, new municipal governments throughout Iraq, achievements in hospitals and schools, training of security forces. This cannot be done once a month. It has to be hammered daily. Just like a jingle on a commercial.
Attacks to do not implicate failure. Death does not resolute failure of progress. Progress has always come at a price. History shows that it always will.
President Bush to his credit does have focus. Once he sets his focus, he stays the course, regardless of the sniping. That is a strong trait of a good leader.
You cannot predict what will happen in the future with perfection. If anything, you as a dinar investor should have learned already that what happens to the value of the dinar, and when, is all about probabilities. But then again, isn't life that way.
You have as dinar investors have been told the dinar will peg at this time, at this level, this way, etc... The truth is no one really knows. There are too many unknowns in play at this time. History shows that even the best strategist are wrong a lot, because we cannot weight men's soul's as good and evil. We have to judge men by their past actions, therefore the unforeseen predictablity of human nature is the catch 22 in predicting any out come of a conflict, or when the dinar will come into its own.
What type of men do we have in the new Iraqi Government? Time will demostrate to us, whether these men will spend most of their time creating things of value for the Iraqi people or spend their time taking things of value away from the citizens of Iraq.

-- June 27, 2005 8:50 AM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Can anone gave any insight of the dinar and if this is a goodinvestment. I read the post here and some long details about the war. I am not sure what to make of the board at times but some times it sounds like a BB stock where people are hipping the stock. Pump and dump.

Any good insight would be appericated about the dinar

-- June 27, 2005 11:00 AM ∞

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tommy wrote:

CARL,

just wondering, just for hahas, just say the dinar opened at 5 cents on the dollar or even 1 cent, is it as simple as going to a bank in NY and bringing my dinars in and trading in for american dollars? and just fill out a tax form or something. i have 2 million dinar, the reason i used NY is i live in NJ, love all your comments,

waiting for terrances pig roast, tommy

-- June 27, 2005 11:14 AM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Carl,

Good read! I agree Bush should speak more about the progress being made in Iraq but I have no sympathy for the people who are to lazy to research what is actually going on in Iraq and even this country. The American electorate are like lambs to the slaughter - lapping up whatever BS the mainstream media feeds to them.

"Think education is expensive - try ignorance."

Peace

-- June 27, 2005 11:41 AM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Tommy, I am from Jersey also. What you want to do is bring them over my house - will take care of the rest.

LOL

PS - what exit?

-- June 27, 2005 12:35 PM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Tommy:
As of today, I know of no bank outside of Iraq you can exchange the dinar for any other currency.
When that will happen, I don't no knowledge.
Sorry! no crystal ball.

-- June 27, 2005 12:54 PM ∞

---

tommy wrote:

george, exit 117, union beach

-- June 27, 2005 2:26 PM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Tommy,

Heck your already on the beach - adding on the West Wing?

Exit 26, Route 80 - in the hills.

Peace - brother!

-- June 27, 2005 3:28 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Hello Again , can anyonegave any info on the NID. I heard personnel sayingit si going to PEG soon. However it seems that the values is already moving up and down. Does this mean that ithas already been PEG. I am new to this so any info will be helpful.

-- June 27, 2005 8:08 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Johnnyhavedinar;

Try reading this from top to bottom, it should answer your questions. :)

http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html

Sara.
---
The tourist tried unsuccessfully to get a conversation going with the natives around the stove. Finally he said, "Is it against the law to talk around here?" "Ain't no law," said a native. "But around here a man don't speak less he's sure he can improve on the silence."
---
Sometimes it's nice to be important, but it's always important to have been nice.

-- June 27, 2005 10:14 PM ∞

---

Doug wrote:

What happens if the money is changed like the Afghani money before a new exchange rate. We might be holding worthless paper unless we could fly to Iraq to exchange tne money. Similar to those who held Sadam Money now worthless.
I hope for the best but am not real entusiastic at this point.
The only ones making money right now are those selling on ebay at an inflated exchange rate.
Does anyone know how many dinars are in circulation I have heard as much as 15 Trillion.

-- June 27, 2005 10:41 PM ∞

---

BOB wrote:

FELLAS: I appreciate all your comments and viewpoints which I read and respect your opinion.

I am also an avid supporter of Mr. Bush except in a couple of areas. His plan to use Social Security money to allow individuals to set up some type of private investment will do absolutely zero to improve the Social Security shortfall, instead, it will compound the problem by taking money from Social Security thereby bankrupting the system sooner.

Also, Mr. Bush took off after terrorists immediately after 9/11 with me backing him 100% in
Afganistan where terrorist were. He then began targeting Iraq where weapons of mass destruction could pose a threat to this country. We went into Iraq to destroy WMD only to find that there were none there (maybe somewhere else), and then we became obsessed with the liberation of Iraq from Saddam. Mr. Bush was dedicated to avenging his Father's errors in Iraq and fulfilling the implied promise by his Father to the Iraqi people.

Mr. Roosevelt stayed out of the WWII conflict because we did not have a dog in the race until they bombed Pearl Harbor, and then a sleeping giant was awakened and given a strong resolve. The American people backed the war from start to finish and sacrificed immencely along the way because America had been attacked and we were fighting the attackers.

Again, I am a conservative and back Mr. Bush 95% of the time but this country does not have unlimited resouces to fight evil and rebuild countries throughout the world. When I see a building being blown-up, my first thought now is that bulding will be expensive to rebuild.

I believe that our "do good" attitude is weakening us financially and is gaining us very
few friends throughout the world.

The reason we are in Iraq is questionable but I am capitolistic enough to see a possibility to profit from the dinar.

Don't judge my comments too harshly, I am from a bygone era where people saw things differently. I brought in the newspaper the day that bore the
headlines "Roosevelt is Dead".

-- June 28, 2005 12:00 AM ∞

---

Sgt in Kuwait wrote:

Hello All,

I've been monitoring this site since my deployment in Sept 2004. I've read everyone's comments, and I'd like to make a few FACTS known (as observed here on the ground);

1) ALL the high level Officers (Colonels and Above) are exchanging USD for Dinars in very large quanities, and have been doing so since March in greater and greater quanities than previously.

2) The Kuwaitis are doing the same....at a even greater rate. Their Banks/Exchanges are doing a very brisk business in Dinars, and even the average guys on the street are buying right now.

3) The opinion of Kuwaitis "in the know" is that Kuwait Government wants monetary parity with Iraq as soon as possible. Their concerns revolve around oil price controls, and the possible "preferential" treatment that Iraq will give the US upon resumption of oil production there. Kuwait is at present revamping their oil transportation intrastructure, with the expectation that the pipeline from Iraq to the Gulf will be Kuwait's insurance to keep Iraq in line with OPEC policies.

4) The present head of OPEC Sheik Al-Sabah, is a member of the Kuwait Emir's immediate family. On numerous occasions he has stated that OPEC has to be united against "outside influences" which are striving to spin off individual members with preferential treatment in other areas(Venezuela, Iraq, etc)in return for preferential treatment in Oil Production and pricing.

The exchange rate in Kuwait at present is $684. per 1 million Dinars.

If there is any info here in Kuwait that I can look into for anyone, just ask......

SGT R at SPOD

-- June 28, 2005 3:08 AM ∞

---

mark wrote:

Investindinar;

Sorry for the late response! There have been rumors about needing receipts or a passport with a Middle East stamp in it to cash in Dinar since this whole thing got started back in 03, I am not sure anybody really knows at this point and time, it wouldn't surprise me either way.

-- June 28, 2005 8:19 AM ∞

---

allen wrote:

Economic Study Warns the Iraqi Central bank from Continuing the Policy of Fixing the Dinar exchange Rate

Al Basra - An Iraqi academic study has stated that the policy of the Iraqi government regarding fixing the dollar had positive effects on the national economy, but on the other hand it has resulted in consequences that have negative effects.
The study noted that despite the success of the Iraqi central bank in fixing the exchange rate of the national currency through the process of connecting it with the American currency and preparing the proper atmosphere that has a positive effect on creating a stable environment in the Iraqi market that have to a certain extent led to restoring the confidence of businessmen and investors through relying on the policy of selling 30 million American dollars in the bank's daily auction , which achieved a stability in the remaining of the exchange rate of the Iraqi dinar at 1465 against the dollar in the past two years, this policy has resulted in negative consequences and has harmed the Iraqi economy.
The study, which was conducted by the administration and economy college in Al Basra university, has pointed out that the Iraqi central bank has used a significant part of the reserve of foreign currency for the purpose of fixing the exchange rate of the Iraqi dinar, and the continuation of such method would lead to using up this reserve, which, through time, would consequently result in that the central bank would lose its ability to maintain the equivalence value of the Iraqi dinar, especially as the sums that the bank uses of the dollar is so great and exceeds 7.5 billion dollars a year, which is equivalent to half of the oil revenues.

The study noted that the stability of the exchange rate of the Iraqi dinar as an ultimate goal for the monetary policy did not lead to the stability of the prices of commodities and services, which tended to the great continuous rise. The criteria of prices record show that they increased by 2.5% a month, which means the invalidity of this policy in reducing the rates of inflation in Iraq.

The study stated that this led to evaluating the Iraqi currency more than its value against other currencies, which represents an exaggeration in the Iraqi exchange rate against other currencies that led to the escape of capitals. Reducing the Iraqi exchange rate, for any reason, might lead the people to shift from dealing in the local currency to the foreign currencies to avoid potential loss. The study confirmed that for the monetary policy in Iraq to be effective and active in the economic environment, it should be a part of an efficient economic policy as each of the policies affects and is affected by the other. Maintaining the exchange rate of the Iraqi currency then increasing it at a later stage require, first of all, increasing the efficiency of performance in various economic sectors and increasing the commodity supply of the local production. This would later lead to increasing the purchase capacity of the Iraqi dinar, and consequently improving its exchange rate compared to foreign currencies, in addition to increasing the monetary budgets of commodity sectors, especially the agricultural and industrial, to secure the needs of the Iraqi market. The study said that it is not wise that the general budget of this year designates only 2% for agriculture and 8% for industry. Scientific planning is necessary at the time that agriculture and industry should be supported in an exceptional manner, similar to what developed countries do, such as the United States, which leads the globalization process as it did not hesitate in posing customs fees on its imports of steel, which is imported from Europe and China, when it became necessary to protect the American steel industry.

The study concluded that the cancellation of supporting the agricultural sector and freeing the foreign trade have participated in destroying Iraqi industry, which was, until recently, fulfilling the foodstuffs demands of the local market that is currently full of Iranian, Syrian and Egyptian, and even Kuwaiti, commodities.

This also applies to the industrial field. The continuation of this situation would increase the demand for foreign currencies, which would make the Central Bank subject to continuous attrition to maintain the exchange rate of the Iraqi dinar. It is impossible to continue such a process, unless procedures that reinforce the monetary and economic situation are taken, which would increase the capability of the state to execute more significant projects that are related to the daily needs of the local market.

Jassem Dakhel
Al Sharq Al Awsat

http://www.almendhar.com/almendharen/details.aspx?nID=4174

-- June 28, 2005 8:42 AM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Bob,

With all due respect what the hell does Social Security have to do with the NID. You are like all the other Democrats - attack Bush for his SS reform with no other solution. I am in mid thirties and have no interest in paying for Baby Boomers retirement - no offense. When SS began I think the ratio was like 40 workers for every 1 SS recipient. When I am eligiable to collect SS the ratio will be 2 workers for 1 recipient. That just aint fair and the system will not be sustainable. Stick your head in the sand and problem will go away!
My suggestion is have a National Lottery and means test it - that will keep it going a little longer.

Investindinar,

Come on man take it easy with Passports and Middle East Stamps - Bush signed the damn order that we could buy the stuff.

Peace.

-- June 28, 2005 9:56 AM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Investindinar,

Sorry - that comment was for Mark.

-- June 28, 2005 9:58 AM ∞

---

davey jones wrote:

Hello to all , some good post from Carl,Sara and a few others. But lets get some meat and patatoes on the NID . When is dinar going to PEG. Is this investment/gamble to good to be true? There is so much speculation here, that the NID will be change , dropping the zero. NID holders wil have to go to IRAQ to cahnge thier NID. It seems that there is no solid evidence what will happen in the near or far future.

And another thing this all post by allen, i guess very imformative, but could any one make sense of it. Share the knowledge.

DAVY

-- June 28, 2005 4:59 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Sara???
What's up girl??
I am hearing a lot of rumors here........talk to me. :))

-- June 28, 2005 5:38 PM ∞

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Aaron wrote:

I purchased 50MM NID last November from www.getiraqidinar.com. I did not keep my receipts. I called them today to get a copy e-mailed to me and they were very prompt and courteous. The Invoice showed Fed Ex tracking numbers, dates of purchase and receipt and best of all my money order numbers so if needed it could be tracked back to my bank. I do not know if we will need all this but this company provided a great service for me before and now. I would recommend them for anyone who may be looking.

Just a FYI. I should lose this forum address because all I do is get home and look at it and get anxious. I forget about concentrating on my day to day life as I know it. When it happens it happens. Gods speed though!!!!

-- June 28, 2005 7:17 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Hey Gang....

Why is everyone asking each other questions like they are Yoda or something? If any one on here knew how much and when it was going to peg then we wouldn't be called "Speculators" now would we??? Even the people running this show don't know what's going on so how would you expect any of us to know??? Best advice my friends would be to put your Dinar in a safe place and see where it is in a month or so.

Outlaw

-- June 28, 2005 7:38 PM ∞

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Investindinar wrote:

Dear All,

There have been a few responses to the question I posted about needing receipts and passport stamps for cashing in the NID. It was mentioned that Bush passed an order so that US Citizens could buy NID. But what if you are Canadian or English (that would be my wife and I)?

I do not have the receipts for the dinar, but I do have my passport with the stamp. Will this be enough?

Take Care and Good Luck to All,

Investindinar

-- June 28, 2005 8:24 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Outlaw what makes you think that those in charge do not know what is going on. It is my belief that a lot of things have recently fallen into place that could enable the value of this investment to go up considerably in the very near future. Since I have been sitting on this for about 18 months I am of course anxious to see it do something. I assure you however that I am in this for the long haul if need be.

-- June 28, 2005 8:51 PM ∞

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JB Smith wrote:

Apropos,
.
Goes without saying:

Main Entry: spec·u·la·tion
Pronunciation: "spe-ky&-'lA-sh&n
Function: noun
: an act or instance of speculating : as a : assumption of unusual business risk in hopes of obtaining commensurate gain b : a transaction involving such speculation

-- June 28, 2005 8:51 PM ∞

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Angel wrote:

Sgt in Kuwait ,Hello
I hear alot about all the bad stuff but not much of any of the good .Can you please tell us about the good stuff that is going on there.It would be a breath of fresh air(sort of speak).

-- June 28, 2005 9:42 PM ∞

---

angel wrote:

Hey Sara,
You remember awhile back when I posted that Coke Cola had also invested in NID.Check this out.

Coke Cola to have new presence in Iraq
Turkish firm sets up company to distribute product

Reuters
Published on: 06/28/05
ISTANBUL — Coca-Cola's Turkish partner said on Tuesday it has set up a new bottling operation to serve neighboring Iraq, establishing the soft-drink giant's first permanent presence there in more than 20 years.

Efes Invest Holland, which is wholly owned by Turkey's Efes Sinai Investment Holding and Iraq's H.M.B.S. have jointly set up the new firm, to be headquartered in Dubai's free-trade zone, Efes said in a statement to the Istanbul Stock Exchange.
Efes Sinai Investment is the leading distributor of Coca-Cola beverages in Central Asia.

The new company has signed a deal Coca-Cola to be the sole distributor and seller of the company's products in Iraq, starting July 1, it said.

The Coca Cola Bottling Company of Iraq, with start-up capital of some $165,000, signed another agreement with Coke giving it the option to acquire the Iraqi market's full production and bottling rights within two years, Efes said.

"This shows our intention to establish the first bottling operation since 1980," a company official in Istanbul said.

Coca-Cola drinks are imported into Iraq from Jordan, Turkey and other countries. Coke previously had a presence in Iraq between 1950 and 1968, when the Arab League voted to boycott its products because of Coke's investments in Israel.

After operating in Iraq intermittently in the 1970s, Coca-Cola shut down its operations at the start of the Iran-Iraq war in 1980, the official said.

Pepsico returned to Iraq in January 2004 after a 14-year absence mandated by international trade sanctions against Iraq after it invaded Kuwait. Pepsi first entered the Iraqi market in 1950.

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/coke/0605/28cokeiraq.html

-- June 28, 2005 9:52 PM ∞

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angel wrote:

Sorry forgot the link to my old post about the Coke Cola

http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html#9985

-- June 28, 2005 10:04 PM ∞

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mark wrote:

Michael;
I never said you need a receipt. I said I don't know but the rumor is out there. The IRS says I can have several deductions on my taxes...I still need a receipt.

-- June 28, 2005 11:14 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Michael;

I have heard lots of intriguing rumors, too. I still believe we are looking at a soon peg. :)
I am on vacation, so I'm not doing much more than monitoring the board and checking for the peg. :)
I agree with you that a lot of things have fallen in place, rather providentially I might say, to bolster the prospect of a soon peg date. I agree, I am in for the long haul, too.. if need be. But I am quite certain it won't be necessary.. in other words, I expect a peg soon.
One of the most interesting posts lately in this regard was the one by allen.. http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12393
That post says many things in it, but what I saw in it which was very encouraging to me is summarized by me as saying this..
The current way of dealing with the Dinar is unsustainable.
He said, quote:

"... the continuation of such method would lead to using up this reserve, which, through time, would consequently result in that the central bank would lose its ability to maintain the equivalence value of the Iraqi dinar, especially as the sums that the bank uses of the dollar is so great and exceeds 7.5 billion dollars a year, which is equivalent to half of the oil revenues."

This means we have to be in for a change.
Think about it..
They WILL NOT use up the reserve, now, will they?
This put a smile on my face. :)

Investindinar;

I think it is a good idea to have receipts to prove you bought Dinars legitimately, in case you are asked by the government. Can't you go back to whomever sold them to you and get a receipt like an earlier poster, Aaron, did? They didn't go out of business since they sold them to you, did they? I just think your revenue Canada folks might ask where the Dinars came from. It might be nice to back it up with a slip of paper.. you wouldn't want them being.. difficult.. about your keeping your cash, now, would you?

I'm not anxious, outlaw.. I am very grateful to have been given this opportunity to get in on a very good investment. I don't think passports or Middle Eastern stamps or something will be needed to cash in. I don't think the purpose is to stiff American investors in Iraq, personally. I have a little more faith in the Powers That Be that this is for our good (both the High and Highest). I believe in the investment.. and am glad for others on the train who believe in it, too.

Sara.
PS Yoda believed in a made up god from the mind of George Lucas, not the real one. I wouldn't rely on a comic book deity, myself. Isn't it interesting that people will see the necessity of fighting the fictional Empire, even at great cost of life, but not terrorism? Hmmmm...

-- June 28, 2005 11:22 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Investindinar:
Dont worry about it. The big thing to worry about now is if and when the value of the dinar increase. If you cannot cash in your dinar, just let someone on the board know and surely some will help you for a small fee. I will cash them for you if I can. We are all in the game together anyway. :)

-- June 28, 2005 11:30 PM ∞

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BOB wrote:

Invesindinar:

You, no doubt, are a brilliant man but I believe that you need a course in comprehensive reading.
I mentioned SS as one of the two areas which I disagreed with Mr. Bush on. I will continue to disagree with Mr. Bush when he screws up. You asked me "why mention SS" only to proceed with a mini-dissertation on the subject.

We attempt to stay civil on the T&B, so tone down your remarks and I will give them a lot more credence.

-- June 28, 2005 11:39 PM ∞

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Millionaire2B wrote:

Hi everyone!

Dear BOB, I do appreciate what you're saying also. :)

Dear GEORGEWOOD and fellow GID Assoc. customer, I agree with your solution to SS. How about also using some of the funds from all of the capital gains taxes we'll be be paying to help keep it going for a while longer? :) BTW, my last order arrived within 24 hrs. of my wire to them. :) :)

Dear Allen, Thanks for the article. Seems like the study is trying to encourage the CBI to increase the exchange rate of the dinar?? (at least to me :))

Happily hoping and waiting, M2B

-- June 29, 2005 12:38 AM ∞

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Investindinar wrote:

Dear Michael,

Thank you very much for your reassuring post. I guess you are right.... we are all in this together. It was very nice of you to offer to help us out if we need it.

Thanks again,

Investindinar

-- June 29, 2005 12:46 AM ∞

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Ramis wrote:

If NID is going to peg soon and the investors are likely to incredible return on their investment, then why the hell NID rate is going down in Qatar. It is now Qatari Riyal 2490 = NID 1,000,000, down from QR 2500 = NID 1,000,000 yesterday?

-- June 29, 2005 1:58 AM ∞

---

okie wrote:

Some people are wanting positive facts.....well take a look at this.

Federal News Service (Middle East)

June 23, 2005

excerpt from Federal News Service (Middle East)

-------------------------------------------------

HEARING OF THE HOUSE ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE SUBJECT: IRAQI SECURITY FORCES
CHAIRED BY: REPRESENTATIVE DUNCAN HUNTER (R-CA) WITNESSES: SECRETARY OF DEFENSE DONALD RUMSFELD; GENERAL RICHARD B. MYERS, USAF, CHAIRMAN OF THE JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF; GENERAL JOHN ABIZAID, COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND; GENERAL GEORGE CASEY, COMMANDER, MULTINATIONAL FORCES IRAQ LOCATION: 2118 RAYBURN HOUSE OFFICE BUILDING, WASHINGTON, D.C.

…………………………..REP. HAYES: Okay. I hear you saying that these folks are stepping up and accepting and meeting the challenge of securing and governing their own country. Is that a correct statement?

GEN. ABIZAID: That's correct, sir.

REP. HAYES: Last, but not least, a wonderful staff sergeant, not a general -- like the generals, but the staff sergeants are awful essential to the force -- just back from Iraq, second tour, Fort Bragg. I said, "What message do you have for Congress, Sergeant?" He said, "Leave KBR alone. The food and services they are providing are outstanding."

Thank you, gentlemen.

(Laughter.)

REP. SAXTON: Thank you…………………….

-- June 29, 2005 2:23 AM ∞

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SGT in Kuwait wrote:

Angel, you asked whats it like here on the ground..........

The Iraqis are GLAD we're here. The suicide bombers are mostly made up of former Ba'ath party members, hard-line Islamic extremists, with a dose of Syrian, Palestinian, and Iranian troublemakers paying people's families after they do the deed.
We see everyday the results of our efforts. The kids, the people with hope in their faces, not fear. The construction going on. The pride in the actions and attitudes of the new Iraqi Police and Army Units.
YOUR MILITARY IS DOING YOU ALL PROUD. We're not acting as conquerors, but as peacekeepers. We care less why we got here, but now we're here and we all are doing what it takes to make our mission here happen. We are not representing US Foreign Policy- The President- or the Cabinet Members. We are here representing you all, and we dont forget it. Trust Me when I say that Iraq will never forget us, we have given them their freedom, and a dignity that they have never known. You are getting only one side from the News Networks. Support us as you have, and this thing will be solved. Forget us, and this will turn into a quagmire.

SGT in Kuwait

-- June 29, 2005 9:24 AM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Sarah,

I don't think my post refered to any one person in perticular...Are we feeling guilty or something???? Hmmmmmmm?

Just in case some people forgot... their ARE people willing to risk getting maimed or dying for the sake of ending terror... I and my brothers risk our lives every minuite of the day while others do nothing but complain about what we are doing over here.

Everyone needs to remember why you will have the ability to cash in that Dinar when the time ever does come. :)

Outlaw.

-- June 29, 2005 9:39 AM ∞

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Steve Young wrote:

[Editor's Note: The author of the following comment emailed me, asking me to remove it, insisting that it was a foolish and hurtful joke. I have added this preface instead, to preserve the cogency of the board. -- K. Brancato]

This is to everyone that busted on my coworker Johnny Cash. His post dealing with the airport was as correct. If you think that those 25,000 bills are going to make you rich, well go ahead and jump on them. Second for all the fools here that keep saying their CONTACT on the inside says the dinar will open at 30,40 and even 50 cents....well you are just a fool for believing that. I love reading this forum just to hear how some of you are so far into this dinar that it consumes every breath of your life. The truth is it will be years before this money ever makes ANY of you a penny. And if it never does well it looks like your homes will have the most expensive wall paper known to man. No before I leave to laugh at the pathetic posts I know some of you will leave I just want to say this: You guys really need some professional help. You worship this money like a GOD. But then again all Liberals have no morals... Steve Y.

-- June 29, 2005 9:50 AM ∞

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RYAN wrote:

Hi everyone
my 2 cents on the reciept thing..
when ive exchanged curency before they dont ask about your reciept or where you got the money..also what about people that have given the funds as a gift? they cant go in and exchange? a couple of banks that i spoke to said that our names are run through an fbi watch list to verify that we are not laundering money or have a criminal background... actually they said that if i already owned them my info was already turned over ...two banks said same.... so do you need a reciept, i do not think so... who knows you could have had a friend serving in iraq and mailed them to you, that he exchanged there???but i have mine handy just in case>>>
ryan

-- June 29, 2005 11:24 AM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Sara- All smiles babe! :))

Enjoy your vacation. I will be having my own very soon I think......:)

-- June 29, 2005 11:37 AM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Sara,

After reading my post, I wanted to tell you that I didn't mean for it to come across sounding so sarcastic....I'm having a bad day and mis-read your post. I hope you understand... Sorry!

I was out of line because, I do belive that everyone here on this site understands the cost attached to our Dinar.

Outlaw

P.S. Sorry about mis-spelling your name...I have a Daughter named Sarah. :)

-- June 29, 2005 12:14 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Outlaw;

No problems. I didn't mean anything bad by my remarks, nor were any of them motivated by fear, and I think you will find from my posts that I have been very supportive of the US military and your role over there working for Freedom.

Concerning Freedom, I was thinking that, even though the freedoms we have over here are sometimes abused (and then played up in the media until it looks like the exceptions are the rule), the only alternative to having freedom is to NOT allow freedoms and therefore to live under a dictatorship and oppression. Ruthless suppression of free expression may seem outwardly holy to some, but true righteousness cannot thrive in such an environment. While we do not endorse the misuses of freedom and the seeming license to sin it gives to some in our society (pick up a newspaper and see what I mean), we will continue to fight and defend the ability to have freedom even for those whom we disagree with and the few who will misuse that freedom.

A free culture has the ability to speak their mind and choose freely their behavior. This can be used for good or for evil. If evil, we have laws and a court system to punish the evildoers, and beyond laws, there is a God who sees and punishes.

Those who ridicule our freedom and fight against it wish only tyranny and oppression in the name of holiness. But it is a farce to have enforced holiness through tyranny and oppression. Even a dog can be trained through fear to sit and come on command, but that is not what ennobles mankind and makes him to rise above the level of a beast. Only free choice does that.. for good or evil.

Your sacrifice to allow us to keep our freedoms and spread them to other nations who are crying out for freedom, Outlaw, and all those who are serving, is appreciated.

Sara.

-- June 29, 2005 1:28 PM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Bob,

That was not Investdinar that responded to your Social Security point it was I.

Bob, I may need a reading comprehension course but you need a history lesson. Roosevelt, did not keep us out of WWII. He did everything he could to get us into the war and sacrificed countless numbers of people at Pearl Harbor for that end. Not to mention giving away Eastern Europe to Stalin at Yalta and relegating millions of people to live under the Iron Curtain because he was a dying man losing his faculties at that point.

Bob, I agree the board should be civil but when you attack the President please understand I feel a duty to respond to your attacks. What I cant figure out is if you are against the war why did you invest in the NID?

Ever hear the expression "A mile wide and an inch deep"?

-- June 29, 2005 1:44 PM ∞

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Foz wrote:

Hi all, please forgive my ignorance on this matter, but ive just come across this information in the last hour by someone selling Iraq Dollars on ebay and i thought why? After reading the very inviting statements i decided to check if there was any more information on the internet about this and so this led me to yourselves.

Now i dont claim to know what REALLY is happening but from some of the comments from what seems experienced people on here theres POSSIBLY something in all these claims.

So from what i gather anyone can buy Iraq dollars at the moment, keep them for a while and the chances are you may make some money if all goes well? Is this the case? Forgive me if i seem a little out of my depth...

-- June 29, 2005 2:33 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Saudi Arabia has a new list of wanted men
June 28 2005 at 04:09PM

Riyadh - The Saudi Arabian interior ministry on Tuesday released a new list of more than 30 suspected militants wanted on terrorism-related charges both inside and outside the kingdom.

Most of those on the list, carried by official media, are Saudis, but they also include suspects from Chad, Kuwait, Mauritania, Morocco and Yemen.

This is the third time it has published a list of wanted extremists. - Sapa-AFP

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=123&art_id=qw1119961981355B235

-- June 29, 2005 4:53 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Board;

Steve Y's post gives us another good opportunity to think about how to handle it when it does go and folks like him are out in the cold.. we really shouldn't gloat, you know. Trying hard to learn humility here.. it will be pretty hard when the time comes not to say I TOLD YOU SO.. you know? (Is this a human failing or what?) Interesting name calling.. Liberal.

Michael - put yer shades on and have a relaxing vacation.. hope there is a nice beach in view. :) If not, think of the pig roast we're gonna have on the beach and relax in the sun.. have a great one. :)

Interesting info, Ryan.. thanks. :)

I appreciated hearing both sides Georgewood, your post was interesting as a balance to Bob's viewpoint.. thanks. :)

Foz, yes, you basically have the idea.. Dinars are a speculation that the Iraqi money will not remain 1465 Dinars to the US dollar.. which is crazy for the second largest oil producer in the world (or perhaps first) with oil hovering at about 60 dollars a barrel.. for starters. Read the previous posts on T & B for some more info here: http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html

Sara.

-- June 29, 2005 6:39 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Michael;

And if you meant a vacation is due when the Dinar pegs, YES.. :) I trust it'll be time for an extended vacation.. pretty soon. :)

Sara.

-- June 29, 2005 6:54 PM ∞

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BOB wrote:

My apologies to InvestinDinar.

Georgeman, You have almost convinced me that if my comments can't be interpreted any better than you did, then I need to back off and stop talking.

I simply said that Mr. Bush wanted to take money away from SS to establish private accounts which
compounds the Ss shortfall. I do have a solution,
raise the retirement age or raise the rate of SS deductions (the only solution). The private accouts do absolutely nothing to prolong the day when SS goes broke.

I hate garbage, but if I thought that I could make money investing in a Waste Disposal Company, then I would do it.

Get real, young man.

-- June 30, 2005 12:02 AM ∞

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dinardaddy wrote:

i have a question all of these speculations are floating on the post 1 question for sarah or any one elses who can answer it how do we know when this will peg i am like most of you and egar for a change heck if it goes 1 penny i will happy :)

-- June 30, 2005 8:38 AM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Steve Young,

Upon your advice I ordered an additional 2 million NID this morning. Your comment about liberals was pure poetry - dude if you are a conservative please get the hell out of the country and take your buddy "The Man in Black" with you. Your giving conservatives a bad name -I have a cave in Pakistan that would be perfect for you.

PS - how do the 49ers look this year?

-- June 30, 2005 9:38 AM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Steve Y....

I don't think anyone was jumping on your friend "Johnny Cash". Like I said in my post about his comment... "The BIAP is no different than any other Airport in the world"..."they all rip you off". So I wouldn't use the extreamly highly inflated cost of products at the BIAP to be used as an example of how much the Dinar will open at. We can't compare oranges and apples.

As far as the 25,000 Dinar bills...I think that one would be foolish to think that the government is going to de-value the higher bills and leave the smaller ones alone. Just dosen't work that way...they might not re-issue the bigger bills after their exchanged...but...de-valued to be worth less dosent make sense. One dinar will be the same value no matter if that is a single Dinar or in a group of 25,000 other Dinars. Does that make sense Steve?

Outlaw

-- June 30, 2005 10:59 AM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Hello All, I found this artical and thought it was interesting..

Iraqi President Jalal Talabani discusses the case against Saddam Hussein, the progress that has been made in reconstructing the country and the perils of "barbaric" and "gruesome" terrorist who threaten to destabilize the country. The Iraqi government, he believes, could bring the horror under control within a year.

http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/spiegel/0,1518,362617,00.html

-- July 1, 2005 1:18 AM ∞

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Dixon_the_Genius wrote:

I am speculating on NID for the last one and half years, in the expectation that when this NID stuff will be bring charms into my life.

Hah!... man so many things are unpredictive and uncontrolable. Sometimes we see things happened that we think, sometimes not and sometimes quite contrary to what we think.

The value of NID is conditioned to improvement of so many factors...socio-political, socio-economic, insurgio-military, clergio-liberal, religio-regional, religio-political and so on and so on........!

There seems not a better time for the betterment of so many factors except only we accept and hold the faith that time will prove that what we think will happen to the satisfaction of people of iraq as well as for the wish of the ambitious NID holders....!

The uncertainty principle can be applied to the NID-iraq parity!

Sometimes it happens that things become chaotic even if everything is going well.... and at the other times it happens that everything is chaotic and still some order emerges out of chaos. It has to be a natural process...whatever is going on in the minds of the people who think about the Iraq from any aspect; whether they are the americans, the iraqis or the insurgents...anyone can be stupified and anyone can be glorified....nothing predictable!

The question is .. who will be the final victor with a victory in what state of conditions? and what will be worth of this glittering paper of money with a smiling face of Hamurabi on it?

Ask the CBI, the people of iraq, ask Mr. Bush, the other banks, the insurgents, the religious zealots, the leaders and politicians.....the money markets....any answers?

Give me a clue if you can....
anyone help me please!!!!

Dixon_the_Genius

-- July 1, 2005 3:32 AM ∞

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JB Smith wrote:

(Hmm,)
over at IIF i saw someone compare
Iraqi and Afghani "money"
...
being as how Afghani "money"
is worth two cents
and Iraq has more resources,
stands to reason
Iraqi "money" should be worth more,

because it seems this comparison
happens frequently,
i ask,
isn't the proper term "monetary unit"
?

IOW
people seem to view an Iraqi Dinar
as a monetary unit
similar to a dollar,

but with all the variables...
why isn't it similar to a penny?

Only far less valuable...?

Is it a semantic matter of fractions?
as in a penny is 1/100 dollar
and a Dinar isn't a fraction of anything?

Does anyone expect a penny to be worth 33 pennies?

I guess it goes back
to another question i keep questioning;
what makes anyone think the Dinar
isn't already pegged?
(And in fact,
artificially over-valued
by CBI intervention...)

I've been enlightened
(i think)
i'm told a high peg
means nothing internally,
as in the "average Iraqi"
wouldn't know the difference.
OTOH a high peg
could take down the economy
if the CBI can't back it up...
i ask again...

If it works,
why fix it?

.don't jump on me
for being "negative"
when i'm only confused.
Sorry but the day my dollar
left the gold standard,
it became a total
figment
of (someone else's) imagination.
Now i'm watching to see
what (someone else) imagines
an Iraqi Dinar to be worth...

...black gold, or another figment?

(hmm,
i said, "people seem to view"..
certainly it's OK with me
if they imagine a large figment.)

-- July 1, 2005 12:11 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

I believe... It will go. :)

Dixion_The_Genius;

You said: "Ask the CBI, the people of iraq, ask Mr. Bush, the other banks, the insurgents, the religious zealots, the leaders and politicians.....the money markets....any answers?"

You forgot to ask one very reliable source of information on the future.. and the most important person to ask in my opinion.. God. :)

In the past, many ancient people, when trying to know the future, turned to occultic means (crystal ball lookers, people who consult with those who are already dead in seances, etc) to discern what would happen in the future. God invites men to ASK HIM.

(After all.. He isn't guessing; God knows everything (is Omnicient) - so He KNOWS the future and therefore He KNOWS if it will go.)

Isa 8:19 And when they shall say to you, Seek to them that have familiar spirits, and to wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek to their God? for the living to the dead?

Isa 30:15 ...in quietness and in confidence shall be your strength...

If you ask that source.. you will find the confidence you need to KNOW that it will go. :)
After all.. God doesn't have the ability to lie.

Tit 1:2 ... God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began...

You mentioned all those factors that go into such an investment when you said:

"so many factors...socio-political, socio-economic, insurgio-military, clergio-liberal, religio-regional, religio-political and so on and so on........!"

I don't think anyone knows ALL the factors involved and can factor them in properly BUT God. And if He says it will go, even if you are not sure about all the factors and how they fit in the jigsaw puzzle, you can be sure it will work out. In childlike faith, I therefore suggest that the most reliable source for you to ask.. is God. :)

Mar 10:15 ...receive the kingdom of God as a little child...

Luk 17:21 Nor will they say, 'See here!' or 'See there!' For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you."

Mat 7:7-8 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and you shall find; knock, and it shall be opened to you: For every one that asks receives; and he that seeks finds; and to him that knocks it shall be opened.

The answer really can be simple, if you are willing to receive it.
I believe it will go though I cannot put the jigsaw together perfectly. :)
(Ever had those vexatious pieces that just WON'T fit in a jigsaw?)

Sara.

-- July 1, 2005 12:21 PM ∞

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JB Smith wrote:

>>ask Mr. Bush

i'll bet he knows.

SOMEONE KNOWS!

.

-- July 1, 2005 12:51 PM ∞

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James Pegelow wrote:

Attention DINAR Buyers: My Best Buying Experience...
The posting June 25 seeking positive transactions
is best answered with the 2 day service I just received from a group in Arizona from stock on hand!
I have much praise for these folks, I paid $30.00 to open an account, and I now present them to you with full confidence through this website:
www.myfreedinar.com/iraq

Jimmy P

-- July 1, 2005 1:07 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

I agree with that Smith fella. The dinar has already Pegged . We all have been suckered into buying this worthless paper. The only ones that made money are the dealers.

The old saying is "if it sounds to good to be true" then" fill in the blanks.

The people that are doing all the posting are the dealers , just like a pump and dump BB stock.

They have made suckers of you all and some fools are qouting the bible. How crazy is that. For all of you that has inside information , post so real facts.

And for all of you that say that you are in the service on the ground in Iraq, what are you all doing on the computer, there is a war going on.

-- July 1, 2005 1:46 PM ∞

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Terrance wrote:

"It can not be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians, not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ!"

Patrick Henry

"I am sure that never was a people, who had more reason to acknowledge a Divine interposition in their affairs, than those of the United States; and I should be pained to believe that they have forgotten that agency, which was so often manifested during our Revolution, or that they failed to consider the omnipotence of that God who is alone able to protect them."

George Washington -

Happy Independence Day everyone -

Keep our troops and their families back home in prayer- especially those little ones who's dad's half way aroung the world.

Be thankful for this great nation. We are all blessed to be free -

See you all at the pig roast in Hawaii.
BTW - Who's brining the ukalele?

On the West Coast...

Terrance

-- July 1, 2005 5:21 PM ∞

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mark wrote:

1. The garden of Eden was in Iraq.

2. Mesopotamia, which is now Iraq, was the cradle of civilization!

3. Noah built the ark in Iraq.

4. The Tower of Babel was in Iraq.

5. Abraham was from Ur, which is in Southern Iraq!

6. Isaac's wife Rebekah is from Nahor, which is in Iraq!

7. Jacob met Rachel in Iraq.

8. Jonah preached in Nineveh - which is in Iraq.

9. Assyria, which is in Iraq, conquered the ten tribes of Israel.

10. Amos cried out in Iraq!

11. Babylon, which is in Iraq, destroyed Jerusalem.

12. Daniel was in the lion's den in Iraq!

13. The three Hebrew children were in the fire in Iraq (Jesus had been in
Iraq also as the fourth person in the fiery furnace!)

14. Belshazzar, the King of Babylon saw the "writing on the wall" in Iraq.

15. Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon, carried the Jews captive into Iraq.

16. Ezekiel preached in Iraq.

17. The wise men were from Iraq.

18. Peter preached in Iraq.

19. The "Empire of Man" described in Revelation is called Babylon, which
was a city in Iraq!

And you have probably seen this one. Israel is the nation most often
mentioned in the Bible. But do you know which nation is second? It is
Iraq! However, that is not the name that is used in the Bible. The names
used in the Bible are Babylon, Land of Shinar, and Mesopotamia. The word
Mesopotamia means between the two rivers, more exactly between the Tigris
and Euphrates Rivers. The name Iraq, means country with deep roots.

Now, Johnnyhavedinar this is the modern era, having satelite IT support in a war zone is really not difficult!

-- July 1, 2005 10:40 PM ∞

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Dixon_the_genius wrote:

Sara!

Thanks for feedback and comments... i highly appreciate your generous explanation....:)

But you see ... aren't we the humans are the manifestations of God. Inside us we possess an eternal affinity with devinity... Therefore, even the answers of God have to come through a human being..or.. we humans can tune overselves to the level where the speech of God is heard and understood...this is the only channel of truth.....!

This is what i believe ...and i totally agree with you....:)

May God help us all!

Dixon_the_genius

-- July 2, 2005 1:51 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

Hey Johnnyhavedinar,

What are you doing on your ass in the States? We could use a jackass with all the answers here. If you'd like to back up you ignorant mouth, go enlist. If not, dont insult us with your armchair quarterbacking.....

If you'd like to correspond to me, send your email to;

william.rynd@SPOD.arfor.army.mil

-- July 2, 2005 2:42 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

johnnyhavedinar,

Your name says it all.....How many dinar would you have if we wern't HERE.

I go on for a 14 hr shift, come off, spend $8.00 a hour to AAFES to go on the internet, and recieve doggerel from someone the likes of you. Have you EVER done ANYTHING for ANYONE, other than yourself?

Believe me, YOU are NOT the reason we're here. But your right to ramble with your idiotic ideas IS...............

SGT at SPOD

-- July 2, 2005 4:20 AM ∞

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vador wrote:

Love reading this blog about the NID, got my 2.5 million last july for 650 USD for 1 Mil NID while over seas serving our great country in Bahrain. One can only hope we make money, but man it sure does seem some here are hangin the nest eggs on a LONG SHOT at best if it has a shot at all.
But as always on T&B it goes to the holly roller quoting crap again. Not that the book that is crap. The crap comes from those who feel that it's there "devine intervention" in life to quote the book and how it will effect the NID. Praying and quoting that is fine but come on, stop wasting bandwidth like I just did on something not even related to NID

John, US Navy.

-- July 2, 2005 7:13 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Dixon
In ref to "The answers coming from God through a human being, tuning to the speech of God and understanding it, etc;;"
The problem is the interpretation.
Problem
Human beings come from many different cultures and influences. Thus when the Big Guy or Little Woman, the universe,(all are the same just go by different names, sort of like you having 3 different names, "mary sue allen" you get the drift.(I'm not sure of your culture so I will give you all three examples) speaks, the North American Humanoid hears the words but they are understood one way.The middle eastern culture humanoid, hears the same words from the same diety, and understands them another way, the humanoid sitting on the cliff in China, hears the same words but their cultures gives them a different interpretation. Remember! "the story of The Tower of Bable" in the christians Bible". Maybe its just all Babble to all, even thou the diety is doing his best to get the message across.
Its not the messager thats having the problem, its the little humanoids running around here on the ground planting IED's, and the Romanian Priest who hung his nun recently, because he thought she had the devil in her. It was the North American humanoids who dunked men, women, and children at the end of a stick, into a pool of water until they drown, or beat them with stones, or burned them alive at the stake. What was their crime? Because they were found guilty of being witches,they used herbs for medicine, and healed people. Only God had this power to heal,so it must have come from the Devil. Thus, it was proof, they were in leaque with the Devil.(Boy! God must have had static on the line that day, Huh!)
It was the Italian humanoids, who were going to put columbus to the screws and rack because the "godly people" all knew the world was flat.Columbus had been telling everybody about the world being round. After all didn't God tell the anointed messengers of God, who could interpret his words just what the truth is, and BY...GOD.. IT... WAS... FLAT ?
No! Dixon tha genius!, I don't believe the record of humanoids understanding just what the diety is trying to get across to us humanoids has very much dependability.
I suggest you toss a coin, head or tails. You might get closer to being right, than listening to a someones interpretation of just what God wants. It least it may give you a better date of when the dinar will peg.

-- July 2, 2005 7:47 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Common Sense?

Dixon_the_genius;

I'd have to agree with you when you said:
"aren't we the humans are the manifestations of God. Inside us we possess an eternal affinity with devinity... "

Absolutely. Even Paul said:
Act 17:24-29 God that made the world and all things in it, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands; Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he gives to all life, and breath, and all things; And has made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation; That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us: For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring....

All people of ALL nations are one blood and "manifestations of God", we are all "His offspring", having as you said, an eternal affinity with divinity. The problem is when men choose to turn from that light and choose darkness, and the voice of God gets willfully ignored or drowned out in favor of their own ideas or opinions. Then they act according to that which is not in affinity with the divine, but is darkness and evil. And they can justify their evil in their own eyes at that point by using God's name and saying their error is all His idea.

Whether it is the crucifying of a nun, the burning of supposed witches, the intolerant Roman Catholic pontiff and his clerics threatening Columbus or the Muslim planting the IED, all of them missed the boat somewhere and got lost along the way, and yet claimed it was God who led them in that error. But they did not see where the error was, the point at which they chose the darkness and rejected the light. They think they have always walked in light and never chosen darkness. Indeed, thinking they are walking in the Light, they will commit the most awful atrocities and errors of judgement... and because of those sins they will die without instruction in their error.

Pro 5:21 For the ways of man are before the eyes of the LORD, and he ponders all his goings.

Pro 5:22 His own iniquities shall take the wicked himself, and he shall be held with the cords of his sins.

Pro 5:23 He shall die without instruction; and in the greatness of his folly he shall go astray.

The folly is to miss receiving the light when it is given and choose another opinion than God's. Each of the examples Carl gave were people who turned, not to God, but to their own thoughts or other men's thoughts about what they THINK God would say. As Carl pointed out, some said they were, quote, "the anointed messengers of God, who could interpret his words just what the truth is, and BY...GOD.. IT... WAS... FLAT." I don't see much asking God for His opinion in that, do you? A little presumptuous to claim all correct interpretations even of God's written words, isn't it? I don't see that those who burnt witches or the ones who crucified the nun were following God's direction or words in their actions, do you? Could you see Jesus doing any of those things? Did His example on earth speak of a man who would do any of those acts (torturing people on racks with screws, crucifying them, burning them)? Yet some might dare to say it was done in His name. Crazy.

For those who plant the IEDs on the roadsides to kill, can you imagine what possible excuse they could give on Judgement Day? Not one could hold up. And if they said, "God (allah) told me to do it." there would be a million MUSLIMS to condemn it. As I read in an article a few days ago which spoke of the new list of 36 terrorists put out by Saudi Arabia, quote:

The list of the 36 suspects included seven foreigners from Chad, Morocco, Mauritania, Yemen and Kuwait.

The ministry has offered a bounty of up to SR7 million for anyone who helps capture a terrorist or foil an attack.

A member of the Shoura Council, who is a leading cleric, has said clerics in the Kingdom are willing to talk with the individuals who strayed from the right path and convince them to return to the Muslim fold.

Sheikh Abdul Mohsin Al-Obaikan, who is member of the Kingdom’s Supreme Ulema (scholars) Council, said both the government and the scholars are willing to initiate a debate and convince them to return to the right path. He referred to the royal amnesty issued last year for militants to turn themselves in as a sign of such willingness.

Al-Obaikan said following the amnesty a number of terrorists had surrendered to the authorities voluntarily and were currently leading a normal life with their families.

“We are ready to enter into dialogue with whoever is willing to return to the right path of Islam. Islam is the religion of mercy and peace,” he added.

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=1§ion=0&article=66208&d=1&m=7&y=2005

By the account of their own clerics, those planting IEDs have strayed from the fold, from the "right path of Islam.. of mercy and peace". These murderers go astray from the light they have within their own religion to walk on in darkness.. in the greatness of their folly they go astray.. to die in the end without correction, in error from the Truth, living in lies. This is always the way it goes when mankind turns from the Light they are given and embrace error.

Rom 3:3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?

Rom 3:4 Certainly not! Indeed, let God be true but every man a liar.

Indeed, God will remain true, though men make themselves liars and turn from the truth, justifying their errors and using His name to do evil. It does not change the Truth, nor God, if men make themselves evil liars, misusing His name to justify their atrocities.

Therefore, Dixon_the_genius, if, as you say, "the answers of God have to come through a human being", you had better be sure the persons you are listening to are not among those rejecting the Light they have been given. Always seek greater light and listen only to those you think are attaining to more. Shun and avoid those who might lead you to plant IEDs along the roadside to blow up innocent persons or that might lead you to kill, torture, burn or crucify fellow human beings in the name of God. As Carl said, listening to someone who rejects Light and walks in darkness (all the while claiming to be in the Light), it might be wiser to, "toss a coin, head or tails. You might get closer to being right, than listening to a someones interpretation of just what God wants."

Seems common sense not to follow such error as would lead to doing such evil acts and atrocities, doesn't it? Yet there are those this day who cannot see this and walk on... to die without the knowledge of this rather obvious instruction.

Sara.

-- July 2, 2005 11:46 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

The Criminal Element....
are we whitewashing??

On a more base level, there are those after the wealth of Iraq for themselves. It isn't about religion to them.. they use the cover given of the religious jargon to justify using muscle to get what they want. The PM of Iraq said on June 24th about the media:

"...sometimes they call the criminals by colourful and heroic names such as “the resistance’.”
He accused Arabic media of failing to cover the raping and killing of women by criminals who then confess."
http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/June/focusoniraq_June151.xml§ion=focusoniraq&col=

When is the last time you ever heard about the raping and killing of Iraqi women in Iraq?

And what about the drug abuse problem in Iraq, how much have you heard of it?

Hospitals wage a different war: Against addiction
By Mona Mahmoud and Melanie Eversley
USA TODAY
BAGHDAD — Iraqi and American medical experts say they have noticed a rise in drug abuse and trafficking in Iraq since the U.S.-led invasion in 2003.

Among the reasons:

•Loose border controls between Iraq and Iran, where drugs flow in from Afghanistan, the source of poppies used to make opium and heroin, say Keith Humphreys, a Stanford University substance-abuse specialist who is helping Iraq rebuild its mental health system, and Paul Hughes, an Iraq specialist with the U.S. Institute for Peace.

•An unsettled atmosphere that nurtures organized crime, which profits from illegal drug sales, says Salih al-Hasnawi, a psychiatrist and director of the health department in Karbala, 50 miles southwest of Baghdad.

•Thousands of former criminals, released by former leader Saddam Hussein, involved in the drug trade, says Rawnaq Aqrawi, a pharmacist in Baghdad.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050624/a_iraqweek24.art.htm

How come the media shows this as a strictly religious war when there are criminals selling drugs, raping and murdering for their own ends under that "religious" umbrella? Why are the facts being covered up? Why is the media not giving definitive coverage to these aspects of the war? Are the media whitewashing these aspects of the war on terror?

Sara.

-- July 2, 2005 12:03 PM ∞

---

Lila wrote:

Johnny may have Dinar, but Johnny needs to get a clue.
This is a quote from James Madison:
"We have staked the whole future of American civilization, not upon the power of government. We have staked the future of all our institutions upon the capacity of mankind for self-government; upon the capacity of each and all of us to govern ourselves, to control ourselves, to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God. (James Madison)

Government stems from within the heart of man. What you believe and confess is evident in your society.
This is a quote from Hugo Grotius:
"He know not how to rule a kingdom, that cannot manage a Province; nor can he wield a Province, that cannot order a City; nor he order a City, that knows not how to regulate a village; nor he a village, that connot guide a Family; nor can that man Govern well a Family that knows not how to Govern himelf; neither can any Govern himself unless his reason be Lord; nor can Reason rule unless herself be ruled by God, and wholly obedient to Him."
A Union must spring from an internal unity. It can't be forced. That is why this nation has been so strong. But unless we return to our roots and begin, again, to teach our children where our strength comes from (God) we will forget our beginning and come to the end of our Christian society. But I don't believe we will ever go that far because of the foundation that our fore fathers laid. I believe in the American people.
Johnny this was the confession of those who signed the American Constitution:
Romans 10:9-10:
That if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you shall be saved; for with the heart man believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.

Joshua 22:15
...chose you this day whom you will serve...as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

I believe that trusting God and living for Him is the best that I can do for America. God Bless America! Have a happy and safe 4th of July week-end!
Lila

-- July 2, 2005 12:50 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

For those who trys to bash me for my opianions great. For the ones that thinks i did not serve, i have not a low life. US NAVY 1976-2001 Retired Chief . So brothers and sister when some of you all was still in grade school , I stood the watch over america. I sail the seas and i protected freedom . I stood the watch oversea so the enemy while not come to our shore as some of you all are doing today. Go bash on the low lifes that want freedom with out making any sacrfice for this country and freedom they enjoy.

-- July 2, 2005 12:58 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Vador/John;

You said:
"The crap comes from those who feel that it's there "devine intervention" in life to quote the book and how it will effect the NID"...

ummm.. do you suppose God sits up there and twiddles His thumbs, or does He have ANYTHING to do with current events in His world?

Psa 24:1 The earth is the LORD's, and the fulness thereof; the world, and they that dwell therein.

If the earth is the Lord's.. and ALL the folks dwelling in it.. do you think He has any will in what happens in it, and to its people? And, if that affects the NID's prospects (an indirect affect) is it wrong to seek to see what He is doing and speculate how it might affect the Dinar's fortunes?

If the Good Book says of those that "gather themselves together against the soul of the righteous, and condemn the innocent blood" that God "shall bring upon them their own iniquity, and shall cut them off in their own wickedness" (Psalm 94), is it wrong to check the earth and see if it is happening in real time on the earth (maybe through direct Divine agency or through the agency of folks like you in the Armed Forces?)? And if it does happen on earth in real time, and that affects the fortunes of the Dinar, (which it will if the terrorists are defeated, as you know) is it wrong to discuss it?

Sara.

PS Lovely thoughts for the 4th Terrance, thank you for them. :)

Mark, I didn't know all that about Iraq/Babylon.. particularily that the Assyrians were Iraqi. I shall have to reread some Scriptures that the Lord has said about Assyria, should be an interesting study.. thanks!

-- July 2, 2005 1:49 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Johnnyhavedinar;

Your post:

http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12466

It had some rather inflammatory words and remarks in it. Perhaps you were very good in the fighting forces, but you lacked somewhat in that post in the area of diplomacy. I do not mean to deprecate you by saying so, but you did say:

"We all have been suckered into buying this worthless paper. The dinar has already Pegged. They have made suckers of you all...
And for all of you that say that you are in the service on the ground in Iraq, what are you all doing on the computer, there is a war going on."

That kind of made a few people to get their backs up, you know??

You say you are, "US NAVY 1976-2001 Retired Chief", and we appreciate the sacrifice that means. But calling us all suckers and saying you KNOW the NID has pegged, is a little out of the area of your expertise even from your Navy background. (No offense intended.) You, too, do not have a crystal ball to be able to say with certainty the statements you were making are absolutely true. You must admit you could be proven wrong. Perhaps it will be nice for you to find yourself incorrect in this case. :)

As SGT at SPOD said, "How many dinar would you have if we wern't HERE." That is true, you know. And mark's comment is valid that "this is the modern era, having satelite IT support in a war zone is really not difficult!" You can think back about your own service and know that there was some free time and you can recall how you spent it. This isn't such a bad use of time to come on here sometimes between shifts, you know. All work and no play, even for a Johnnyhavedinar, would have driven you crazy. Give them as much slack as you would have cut yourself. :)

I therefore respectfully suggest, sir, that you please keep your posts more civil and less inflammatory. Then you shouldn't draw any accidental friendly fire.. :)

Sara.

-- July 2, 2005 2:37 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

hello Lila, i do have a clue and what have you done fore this wonderful country. I know! you pump dinars on ebay and the web to make money of others. And Sgt good luck with doing your time , it's the changing of the guards .

-- July 2, 2005 3:16 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Nice, Lila, appreciate it. :)
"They also serve who only stand and wait" - John Milton.
Did you know that the word Independence means.. (in.. deos (deity, God) pend (like pendulum - to hang)) or literally, In-God-it-all-hangs.
Our Independence means that we stand independent of men, our destiny as a nation hangs only in God.

Have a great Independence Day, all. :)

http://www.crosscards.com/july4/crosscards.aspx

Sara.

-- July 2, 2005 4:01 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

Settle down there sailor. We are not the enemy. Relax a little bit. Read and learn from these people. They seem to be the "smart" ones. LOL
Have a safe and happy 4th all. :)

-- July 2, 2005 9:00 PM ∞

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Mark wrote:

SGT @ spod, I do not care if you are at A pod, Navistar, virginia or any where else south of the border! I appreciate what you do and your comments, Johnnyneedstoselldinar really got me HOT! What do you A retired chief....know about war, ground combat and re building of a country...DC central needs you to report a little damage so get your broom and go sweep the cob webbs out of your mind! Semper FI People

-- July 2, 2005 10:47 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Deaths from Iraq attacks drop sharply in June
(AP)
1 July 2005

BAGHDAD- Deaths from insurgent attacks in Iraq fell sharply in June following one of the bloodiest months since Saddam Hussein was toppled, figures showed Friday, after a wave of offensives by Iraqi and US forces.

Chief US military spokesman Air Force Brigadier General Donald Alston declined to give the precise number of car bombings before and after Operation Lighting took effect.

But, he said “in the 25 days after Al Barq (Operation Lightning) the number was less than half.”

Both US and Iraqi officials say diehard Saddam loyalists and militant foreign fighters brought in by the Al Qaeda network are fueling the insurgency.

In Geneva, Iraq’s government called for an international conference to consider a suspension of around 33 billion dollars in outstanding compensation payments it owes for damage caused by the Gulf War, UN officials said.

The body dealing with the payouts, the UN Compensation Commission, completed examination of the last round of claims under a process that began 14 years ago under Saddam.

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/July/focusoniraq_July1.xml§ion=focusoniraq

-- July 3, 2005 12:11 AM ∞

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Dean wrote:

God warned us of "Terrorists." If you want to call them that.

Take a look at John 16:2

...........Yea, the time cometh that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.

That is exactly what "terrorists" think they are doing when they kill Jews and Christians. Exactly, Bullseye.

Another Bible Prophosy fullfilled.

The Dinar train is great, (I'm on) , but the Jesus train is much greater. Hop on, we've got room for you.

-- July 3, 2005 12:17 AM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Mark sweet post, however i don't do any swabbing thesE days, I DON'T NEED TOO, I MAKE A REALLY GOOD LIVING . I wonder what was your MOS . YOU asked me what i know about war? Well I have put many patches and bandages on o311. BTW if you were a grunt , then out on the field you would have wanted to be my best friend. In other words you would be kissing my %%%%%%s

-- July 3, 2005 12:21 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

Chief Johnnyhasdinar,

I came in the Army in 1980, served twelve years active duty, and was separated upon my return from the Berlin Brigade(caught up in the reduction of forces after the wall went down.)After a break of TWELVE MORE YEARS, I enlisted in the reserves February of last year to come here. I figured that my experience would help the "new guard". And it has.

OK, "Cheif", whats your excuse for not being here?

-- July 3, 2005 6:17 AM ∞

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Dave wrote:

While we wait for the dinar to open on world markets, we can all sell dinars and make money! This is a sweet deal!
We love the NID!

-- July 3, 2005 7:57 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

So, who can you trust?

If you can't trust radical Muslim clerics (who teach planting bombs, suicide bombing of innocents), the Roman pontiffs (who threatened Columbus and Galileo with the rack or hell for nonconformity to their teachings), or many of their ministers (see sex scandals, crucifying of a nun in the news recently) the head of a church and a boyscout leader (BTK killer who can't see he has done wrong, nor is he sorry), who CAN you trust? Well, as I mentioned before, God invites us to trust and ask Him (my capitals for emphasis, below).

Isa 8:19 And when they shall say to you, Seek to them that have familiar spirits, and to wizards that peep, and that mutter: SHOULD NOT A PEOPLE SEEK TO THEIR GOD?

Psa 108:11-12 O God,,, Give us help from trouble: for vain is the help of man.

Jer 17:5 Thus says the LORD; Cursed be the man that trusts in man, and makes flesh his strength, whose heart departs from the LORD.

Isa 2:22 Cease yourselves from man, whose breath is in his nostrils: for wherein is he to be accounted of ?

When it seems strange to some to say this should be the way of people of faith in God, I must justify it with references (above) and those who have proven themselves trustworthy ministers of the past (unlike some who have missed the boat as we have seen). Charles Haddon Spurgeon (1834-1892), an apt minister, wrote this:

"Unto Thee will I cry, O Lord my rock; be not silent to me: lest, if Thou be silent to me, I become like them that go down into the pit."
--Psalm 28:1
A cry is the natural expression of sorrow, and a suitable utterance when all other modes of appeal fail us; but the cry must be alone directed to the Lord, for to cry to man is to waste our entreaties upon the air. When we consider the readiness of the Lord to hear, and His ability to aid, we shall see good reason for directing all our appeals at once to the God of our salvation. It will be in vain to call to the rocks in the day of judgment, but our Rock attends to our cries.
"Be not silent to me." Mere formalists may be content without answers to their prayers, but genuine suppliants cannot; they are not satisfied with the results of prayer itself in calming the mind and subduing the will--they must go further, and obtain actual replies from heaven, or they cannot rest; and those replies they long to receive at once, they dread even a little of God's silence. God's voice is often so terrible that it shakes the wilderness; but His silence is equally full of awe to an eager suppliant. When God seems to close His ear, we must not therefore close our mouths, but rather cry with more earnestness; for when our note grows shrill with eagerness and grief, He will not long deny us a hearing. What a dreadful case should we be in if the Lord should become for ever silent to our prayers? "Lest, if Thou be silent to me, I become like them that go down into the pit." Deprived of the God who answers prayer, we should be in a more pitiable plight than the dead in the grave, and should soon sink to the same level as the lost in hell. We must have answers to prayer: ours is an urgent case of dire necessity; surely the Lord will speak peace to our agitated minds, for He never can find it in His heart to permit His own elect to perish.

- Morning and Evening by Charles Spurgeon, July 2, evening reading.

Religion should be more than formalism and outward ceremonies. It should be genuine communication with and walking with God. You know how that song goes.. "and He walks with me, and He talks with me, and He tells me I am His own"?? I didn't stop until I got hooked up directly with God. It can be done. If someone can't hook you up directly with God, they are leading you away from God. Dixon_the_genius said, "the answers of God have to come through a human being"... and they do, until you get hooked up to God and can hear it direct from Him. So the litmus test I would use is.. can this person lead me TO GOD? They are not to lead me to themselves, to a church, to an outward ceremony, to a teaching, nor to 'the results of prayer itself in calming the mind and subduing the will' as Spurgeon says above, no.. not anything else.. but GOD. Don't stop short of obtaining direct communication with Him. If anyone does not lead you to hooking up directly to God Almighty Himself, I would keep looking until I found someone who could show me that way to Him. Anything less than that leaves us trusting in men, and men can easily be lead astray. For the church, they should return to God, for they have forgotten Him and said in their hearts that they will not come to Him anymore, though He has never ceased to be there for them when they did turn to Him.

Jer 2:30-32 In vain have I chastened your children; they received no correction... O generation, see the word of the LORD! Have I been a wilderness to you, or a land of darkness? why do My people say, We are lords; we will come no more to You? Can a maid forget her ornaments, or a bride her attire? yet My people have forgotten Me days without number.

The answer to whom you can trust for direction and help in life is simple.. only God. When we see men and women failing all around us in life... giving false and misleading direction to others around them, we must look higher for answers to the questions we have in and about life. Don't settle for anything less than God to stake your life and direction on, for truly, "vain is the help of man" Psalm 108:12. (Dictionary.com says vain means useless, worthless, fruitless, to no avail; without success, lacking value or substance.)

Sara.

-- July 3, 2005 8:35 AM ∞

---

Carl wrote:

FROM THE MOUTH THE HEART WILL BE REVEALED
Its always amazing to me to watch personalities come to the surface. Role playing in life is a reality. We all have several different roles that we carry during our life time. Brother,Sister, Father, Mother, Policeman, Doctor, Soldier, Sailor,Teacher, etc; each require certain charteristics be displayed.
Most of the time those roles mask a person's real personality.
Position or rank of service does not get you anything but a title. Respect for a individual is earned over time and given freely by a person's peers, when they think it is deserved, not when a person requires it. Demanding respect because of position, knowledge or rank does not get you anything but lip service. Ass kissing is usually demanded by someone who can not get respect any other way, than demanding it be shown.
The Military service is full of those type of individuals. I know, I have served under a few who got promoted, not because of their ability, but because the command found they were such a pain in the ass, that it was easier to promote them away from their unit, instead of dealing with the negative personality, and the turmoil they caused.
So high rank in the military does not always equate to ability, just has educational degrees do not always equal to being wise and useful.
A black heart is usually revealed when someone starts calling names, or trying to belittle.
This black emotion can be temporary brought on by frustration at an event, person or persons, or a display of a person's totally personality.
Either way it gives others a snapshot of whether they want to be around that individual any amount of time.
We have seen several different personalities displayed on this board. I know I have decided who I want to meet at the dinar beach celebration by the way a person displays their true personality brought visble by the words spoken on this board.
There is a on going joke about the Navy in the Coast Guard.
They put the Navy guys on boats that travel in deep water, so they want keep running aground.

Senior Chief US Coast Guard Reserve with 27 years service and still counting.

-- July 3, 2005 9:30 AM ∞

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EJAMM wrote:

This forum is fun to read! All the posts about God and how much money a person can make "gambling" on the Dinar and how the 2 are related somehow...not sure about that.
I have seen my fair share of death and destruction during my time in the military, especially AFSOC, and yet I am still on active duty, but the lessons I received were not in vain. I have gained a new spirituality but I still do not go around quoting versus' and such from a book inspired by God but written, rewritten and interpreted by man (Just asking for trouble there!). Man, a being who has, over the centuries, been proven to be deceitful, manipulative and cruel. There is a message in the bible and a good one I suppose, unfortunately it gets all twisted by human intervention.
As I stated in the beginning, this forum is funny...Heck what am I saying it is hilarious...Thanks for the entertainment, press on soldiers :)

-- July 3, 2005 10:14 AM ∞

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Ed wrote:

Remember the guy who got on a plane with a bomb built into his shoe and
tried to light it?

Did you know his trial is over?
Did you know he was sentenced?
Did you see/hear any of the judge's comments on TV/Radio?
Didn't think so.

Everyone should hear what the judge had to say.
Ruling by Judge William Young, US District Court.

Prior to sentencing, the Judge asked the defendant if he had
anything to say

His response: After admitting his guilt to the court for the
record,
Reid also admitted his "allegiance to Osama bin Laden, to Islam, and to the
religion of Allah," defiantly stated "I think I will not apologize for my
actions," and told the court "I am at war with your country."

Judge Young then delivered the statement quoted below:

January 30, 2003, United States vs. Reid. Judge Young:
"Mr. Richard C. Reid, hearken now to the sentence the Court imposes upon you.

On counts 1, 5 and 6 the Court sentences you to life in prison in the
custody of the United States Attorney General. On counts 2, 3, 4 and 7,
the Court sentences you to 20 years in prison on each count, the sentence
on each count to run consecutive with the other
That's 80 years. On count 8 the Court sentences you to the
mandatory 30 years consecutive to the 80 years just imposed. The Court
imposes upon you each of the eight counts a fine of $250,000 for the
aggregate fine of $2 million. The Court accepts the government's
recommendation with respect to restitution and orders restitution in the
amount of $298.17 to Andre Bousquet and $5,784 to American Airlines. The
Court imposes upon you the $800 special assessment.
The Court imposes upon you five years supervised release simply
because the law requires it. But the life sentences are real life
sentences so I need go no further. This is the sentence that is provided
for by our statutes. It is a fair and just sentence. It is a righteous
sentence.

Let me explain this to you. We are not afraid of you or any of
your terrorist co-conspirators, Mr. Reid. We are Americans. We have been
through the fire before. There is all too much war talk here and I say
that to everyone with the utmost respect. Here in this court, we deal with
individuals as individuals and care for individuals as individuals. As
human beings, we reach out for justice.

You are not an enemy combatant. You are a terrorist. You are not a
soldier in any war. You are a terrorist. To give you that reference, to
call you a soldier, gives you far too much stature. Whether it is the
officers of government who do it or your attorney who does it, or if you
think you are a soldier. You are not----- you are a terrorist And we do
not negotiate with terrorists. We do not meet with terrorists. We do not
sign documents with terrorists. We hunt them down one by one and bring
them to justice.

So war talk is way out of line in this court. You are a big
fellow. But you are not that big You're no warrior. I've know warriors.
You are a terrorist. A species of criminal that is guilty of multiple
attempted murders. In a very real sense, State Trooper Santiago had it
right when you first were taken off that plane and into custody and you
wondered where the press and where the TV crews were, and he said: "You're
no big deal."

You are no big deal.

What your able counsel and what the equally able United States
attorneys have grappled with and what I have as honestly as I know how
tried to grapple with, is why you did something so horrific. What was it
that led you here to this courtroom today?

I have listened respectfully to what you have to say. And I ask
you to search your heart and ask yourself what sort of unfathomable hate
led you to do what you are guilty and admit you are guilty of doing. And I
have an answer for you. It may not satisfy you, but as I search this
entire record, it comes as close to understanding as I know.

It seems to me you hate the one thing that to us is most precious.
You hate our freedom. Our individual freedom. Our individual freedom to
live as we choose, to come and go as we choose, to believe or not believe
as we individually choose. Here, in this society, the very wind carries
freedom. It carries it everywhere from sea to shining sea. It is because
we prize individual freedom so much that you are here in this beautiful
courtroom. So that everyone can see, truly see, that justice is
administered fairly, individually, and discretely. It is for freedom's
sake that your lawyers are striving so vigorously on your behalf and have
filed appeals, will go on in their representation of you before other
judges.

We Americans are all about freedom. Because we all know that the
way we treat you, Mr. Reid, is the measure of our own liberties. Make no
mistake though. It is yet true that we will bare any burden; pay any
price, to preserve our freedoms. Look around this courtroom Mark it
well.
The world is not going to long remember what you or I say here. Day after
tomorrow, it will be forgotten, but this, however, will long endure. Here
in this courtroom and courtrooms all across America, the American people
will gather to see that justice, individual justice, justice, not war,
individual justice is in fact being done. The very President of the United
States through his officers will have to come into courtrooms and lay out
evidence on which specific matters can be judged and juries of citizens
will gather to sit and judge that evidence democratically, to mold and
shape and refine our sense of justice.

See that flag, Mr. Reid? That's the flag of the United States of
America. That flag will fly there long after this is all forgotten. That
flag stands for freedom. And it always will.

Mr. Custody Officer. Stand him down.

So, how much of this Judge's comments did we hear on our TV sets?
We need more judges like Judge Young, but that's another subject. Pass
this around. Everyone should and needs to hear what this fine judge had to
say.
Powerful words that strike home.

God bless America.

-- July 3, 2005 11:55 AM ∞

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MS Rebel wrote:

Hello everybody! I am new to the place and I can see already that you guys are an interesting bunch of people. It is good to see every aspect of our melting pot culture, from the far left to the absolute right. Amen for that. I am a veteran. I served 6 years and unfortunatly a stupid knee injury cost me my 20. So now I support my fellow brothers in uniform working for a DoD subcontactor. I will have you know that I have 3 million IQD. I have reviewed some posts and I would just like to add my two cents in. First off I think a small investment in the IQD is a wise choice. However I must say that to be totally obsessed with it could have negative effects... Now dont start beating me up like you guys do others... I just think that a couple of you might be TOO far into this (like Outlaw)to accept a possible negative return. Everyone wants this to happen. I think it might be 3-6 years, but hey thats why I just put it in the CBI. Now before you start calling me a liar.. there are legal ways to do it and it has been done. Now for the guys who take this too serious I feel the same way others do about being suckered by the almost weekly posts of 30, 40, and 50 cent openings or "Pegs." Man you guys must have chewed off more than you could handle with your investment. It sounds like you are really caught up and your life is consumed by the Iraqi DINAR. I am not picking on anyone (except Outlaw.) It is just an observation. So wether or not you agree on the Dinar, and War- remember our troops dont make policy, they just follow orders or lead. Remember if they didnt wear the uniform no one would be able to speak freely and so on. Now this site is for creditable people with news of the Dinar. Now if it has PEGGED then show us a site that will take it...... Oh by the way...Outlaw if you were to sell your 25 mill on ebay you could take tose earnings to the store and buy 75 mill. Now that would be a smart investment......I will catch you later buddy lol

-- July 3, 2005 12:06 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Al Qaeda Chief of Saudi Arabia Killed in Clash
Sunday, July 03, 2005
RIYADH, Saudi Arabia — Security forces killed Al Qaeda's leader in Saudi Arabia, who topped the nation's list of most-wanted militants, during a fierce gunbattle Sunday, an Interior Ministry official said.
Younis Mohammed Ibrahim al-Hayari, a Moroccan, was killed during a dawn raid by security forces on an area in the capital where suspected militants were hiding, the official was quoted by the official Saudi Press Agency as saying.

Three other unidentified suspects were arrested, and weapons, ammunition, computers and documents were seized, he said.

The unidentified official quoted by SPA said al-Hayari headed Usama bin Laden's Al Qaeda network in the kingdom, which has been ravaged by terrorist attacks during more than two years of violence.

Al-Hayari topped a list issued Tuesday of 36 most-wanted militants sought for participation in previous terror attacks in the kingdom dating back to 2003.

The Interior Ministry official said security forces conducted two simultaneous operations in eastern Riyadh to capture suspects and killed al-Hayari after a shoot-out, while arresting three other suspected militants who were not identified.

It said the first operation ended without incident and with two suspects surrendering. But in the second raid, militants launched a gun battle with troops and lobbed grenades before al-Hayari was killed and another extremist was arrested.

"The two operations have concluded, but we will continue to pursue all the terrorists," al-Turki said.

The report said six security force personnel were slightly wounded in the gun battles while weapons, munitions, communications equipment, computers and documents were seized at both scenes.

This oil-rich kingdom has suffered a series of heavy terrorist attacks since May 2003 when suicide bombers attacked three housing estates for foreigners in the capital Riyadh. The kingdom then launched a wave of retaliatory raids against the militants, and issued a list of 26 most wanted in December 2003. Security forces have killed or captured 23 of the 26 figures on that list.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161442,00.html

-- July 3, 2005 1:03 PM ∞

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Chad Nowers wrote:

I need some help, I have been looking for the post that talks about President Bush signing the bill that gives us the OK to buy Dinar, if anyone knowes where it is I would like to read it. I found where the CBI stated it is against thair roles to take Dinar out of the country, is this going to be a problem when we try to trade them in,I am interested in anyone who might know the facts about this I dont want an opinion I want facts please, thank's for your help

-- July 3, 2005 4:10 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

EJAMM;

Interesting post.
You wrote the Bible is, quote:
"a book inspired by God but written, rewritten and interpreted by man (Just asking for trouble there!)."

Yes, sir, ya are. ;)
I could write pages on it, but instead here is one simple comment on that statement. If you took the United States Constitution and rewrote it into a comic book, don't you think a few Americans might know the difference between the comic book version and the real one which was handed down from the bloodstained hands of the forefathers who fought for the liberty it stands for? Same thing with the Bible. Just substitute the words martyrs for forefathers.

You also said:
"Man, a being who has, over the centuries, been proven to be deceitful, manipulative and cruel."

I agree. If it were up to man to keep the words in the Good Book pure, no hope. Even the words in the Bible say that plainly. One which I quoted recently said cursed is anyone trusting in the strength of men, and vain is the help of men. That would be true of keeping the Bible's words pure, because man is a sinner and has the character you see he does. But in spite of the comic book versions, the Truth will also be out there to be found (if you really want the truth, you will find it) because GOD promised He would keep the very WORDS to each and every generation.. purely.

Psa 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

Psa 12:7 You shall keep them, O LORD, you shall preserve them from this generation for ever.

This simply says the words of God (in the Bible) are pure, and GOD Himself will preserve them to each generation of people on the face of the planet for all time. Since nothing is impossible for God to do because God is Omnipotent (having All Power), it would be presumptuous to say that man's corruption could ever destroy what God has purposed and promised to preserve.

Sara.

Chad - I think you mean the Presidential Order referred to at this url: http://www.dinartrade.com/presorder

-- July 3, 2005 7:14 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Obsession?

MS Rebel;

I always like to find out what exactly a person who is accusing someone is speaking of (in this case you accused Outlaw, but also other unnamed persons on this site), so I went to the Dictionary for the word you used ... obsession.

Dictionary.com says it means:
- a persistent disturbing preoccupation with an often unreasonable idea or feeling; also : something that causes such preoccupation —compare to compulsion, phobia.
- an irrational motive for performing trivial or repetitive actions against your will
- an unhealthy and compulsive preoccupation with something or someone
- A compulsive, often unreasonable idea or emotion

Hmmm.. you think discussing and speculating on the Dinar can be an unreasonable compulsion, irrationally motivated, against our will, unhealthy and a compulsive preoccupation. Quite an accusation for someone writing on a board completely dedicated to doing nothing else BUT discuss and speculate on the Dinar; and a person who owns Dinars himself. Does that make YOU obsessed, because you are a Dinar investor? Or did you buy the Dinar without looking into the investment or its prospects, just to be certain that you would not become "obsessed" with it? And, what exactly are we supposed to be doing on this board, then? (And don't say discuss theology, because that isn't irrational, trivial or against my will, either :) ).

Basically, the entire community of Dinar investors is unhealthy in your view. Why have you invested in Dinar then and why do you post here if you disagree with the Dinar as a speculative venture? We don't think it unreasonable, or we would not have invested. And I don't think any of us are under any compulsion or phobia to discuss or not discuss the Dinar, Iraq and the War on terror (and how it affects the Dinar).

The emotive word you used - obsession, therefore, I think a misnomer. You have a strange way of disagreeing with those interested and contributing to the Dinar board. It is like Carl said, "A black heart is usually revealed when someone starts calling names, or trying to belittle. This black emotion can be temporary brought on by frustration at an event, person or persons, or a display of a person's total personality." Perhaps it is that you would have liked the Dinar to have already pegged and the lack of that happening has caused you to be frustrated, but please, go kick a cat (or the furniture, poor cat) instead of taking your emotional frustrations out on our buddy Outlaw from Iraq (and unnamed others). He has been a great encouragement and I think your negative comments toward him or any other unnamed persons on the board are undeserved.

I did, however appreciate your saying, "I think a small investment in the IQD is a wise choice." and, "if it has PEGGED then show us a site that will take it." I would agree with you on both of these comments. If it were pegged, Banks everywhere would take it as legitimate tender now, just like the other currencies, wouldn't they?

Sara.

-- July 3, 2005 8:17 PM ∞

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MS Rebel wrote:

Sara-

I was told by a few you would be mad. Maybe you should try to open your eyes. Let me say it in more simple way. I bought 3 mill because I can afford to gamble with that small investment. I can afford to gamble with a 25 mill investment. If I lose it so what. It is just money and i will make it back very easy. I was refering to Outlaw because maybe FRIENDS sometime joke and pick with each other. There is no negativity here towards him. Just a simple little picking. But then I understand that you wouldnt know that. Dont worry now you do. As for obseession, well the POINT I was getting at was (Now listen and think about this one) some of you have been consumed with this- Go back to my first post- It seems to be the only driving force to some here- More than family, friends, and faith. Hey we talked about this happening. As you said I am obsessed with it-I dont think so. I just see a small 2-3K investment in the CBI as a great choice. Maybe if you would read the whole post you would see that I signed off towards Outlaw- But I think by then you might have been upset thinking about the intensly large amount of money you put into it and now everyday - YOU count the passing seconds-waiting for news that unfortunantly will not come for a while. You mentioned I was frustrated. You might want to go back and check my comments. I am far from being frustrated. Maye you should read your post and ask your self that question. Outlaw-you have a swell night at work.....

-- July 3, 2005 10:30 PM ∞

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J D Pelton wrote:

M S rebel,

i would like to know how you opened an account at CBI.if you have opened an account there why don't you share the information with this forum.
this is my first time of putting on info on this forum too. my cousin posted here some. please tell us how you opened an account with cbi. if you have opened an account with CBI then what is the big secret.if you don't want anyone calling you a liar then tell us all how to open an account with CBI and I will believe you. thank you JD

-- July 3, 2005 10:48 PM ∞

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EJAMM wrote:

Sara,
As always your words were kind and well written. I am certainly glad you did not take anything out of context. :^}

-- July 4, 2005 12:21 AM ∞

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MS REBEL wrote:

JD,
You must fly into Baghdad. Get a ride into the green zone. Up-armored SUVs are preferred! Then head over to the Al Rasheed Hotel. Oh you must also have DoS friends and a close Iraqi friend who works in the Goverment I wouldnt suggest your average joe! That is all it takes. Each person here should be responsible for bringing their investment to Iraq to exchange it. This is how you are also going to have to exchange your Dinar, unless it becomes accepted worldwide. Believe it or not. Oh once your account is set up, then investing more into the account is simple. Just wire the money. No more haggling on Ebay. GOOD LUCK

-- July 4, 2005 9:14 AM ∞

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RON wrote:

Hello all
Just been keeping an eye on all the posts for awhile now.I hope that all of you,and our brothers and sisters that are fighting for our freedom,and the freedom of the Iraqi people will have a safe 4th of July.
GOD BLESS AMERICA.
RON

-- July 4, 2005 10:02 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

JD Pelton;

Concerning the Dinar being accepted worldwide, I thought you might find this interesting information.

Sara.

---

Dinar to be world currency pegged to the Dollar?

The central Iraqi bank confirms the increase of its balance of the dollar In spite of high demand through the auction article here:

http://www.almendhar.com/almendhare...s.aspx?nID=4175

A good article, summarized by DougMyers on the Investor's Iraq forum as saying this:

((the dollar is chosen to be considered as the currency of the measure for price-setting)), for all foreign currencies, just as that the future of the Dinar in the external dealings is still limited, and it is now considered as an intermediary currencies as for Kuwaiti Dinar ,Jordanian Dinar and the Emarati Dirham, and likewise eastern currencies, like Russian and Romanian. ((The bank in the time being is working on the measures taken to make the Dinar as a convertible currency in the future.))
================================================== =

A world market currency is what they are trying to make out of the Dinar, and it will most likely peg to the Dollar!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last edited by dougmyers

http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?s=a22bfcfda16e403fe2512c84be39d743&t=6598

Also, the Zion bank in Utah buys and sells Dinar

Zion bank in Utah buys and sells dinar.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not sure where to put this . I opened an account with zion bank. They will convert dinar to dollar for free as long as you have an account with them. The were nice enough to pull out the books that show all money they can deal with . Sure enough the NID was there. No i did not ask what the cost of buying or selling.. If you are in Utah, this is good info.

http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?s=a22bfcfda16e403fe2512c84be39d743&t=6761

-- July 4, 2005 12:51 PM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

HEY!
Just read Mrs. Rebels post on signing account with CBI.
Does anybody smell blowing smoke?

-- July 4, 2005 12:52 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

No Balance in the News??

Fox News article:
Monday, July 04, 2005
By Kelley Beaucar Vlahos

WASHINGTON — A contingent of conservatives talk radio hosts is headed to Iraq this month on a mission to report "the truth" about the war: American troops are winning, despite headlines to the contrary.

The "Truth Tour" has been pulled together by the conservative Web cast radio group Rightalk.com and Move America Forward, a non-profit conservative group backed by a Republican-linked public relations firm in California.

"The reason why we are doing it is we are sick and tired of seeing and hearing headlines by the mainstream media about our defeat in Iraq," Melanie Morgan, a talk radio host for KSFO Radio in San Francisco and co-chair of Move America Forward, said.

Morgan said the media is "imposing a Vietnam template on this war."

"This is not Vietnam," she said. "War is war, and it's dangerous, and the killing is taking place all of the time. At the same time, where there is danger, there is success and there is a mainstream media that is determined to shut out that success."

She said the group is going to Iraq to support American troops, who see a disconnection with what they experience and what's being reported in the United States. She said the incongruence is leading to "morale problems."

According to retired Col. Buzz Patterson, host of "The Buzz Cut" on Rightalk, the delegation of seven to 10 conservatives will also include two writers from the Web site FrontPage Magazine, which is published by David Horowitz and the Center for the Study of Popular Culture.

"The war is being won, if not already won, I think," Patterson, who is retired from the U.S. Air Force, said. "[Iraq] is stabilized and we want the soldiers themselves to tell the story."

More than 1 million more Iraqi children are going to school than in 2002. Power, water and sewage projects are ongoing. Public works jobs are being created and the government infrastructure is developing, according to the U.S. Agency for International Development, a lead agency in post-war reconstruction.

"In my opinion, the mainstream media is being biased in not reporting enough of what is going on — they are not reporting the grinding situation on the ground where Iraqis are living in a state they've never lived in before," Dahr Jamail, an American freelance writer who was un-embedded in Iraq until February, said.

Mark Williams, talk show host for KFBK in Sacramento and a member of the delegation, said the group will report "what we see and what we are told," but their collective feeling is that there is mostly good.

"We believe that the emphasis has been placed on the negative and if Americans knew what really was going on over there they would have an entirely different picture," said Williams.

The talk show hosts say more of the successes must be told and the troops need to know that Americans see the positive things they are allowing to happen in Iraq.

"If we see things that aren't going well, sure we're talk show hosts, we'll talk about it," Patterson said. "But there has been no balance. I'm concerned that there are all of these positive things not being reported."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161463,00.html

-- July 4, 2005 1:00 PM ∞

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JD Pelton wrote:

M S rebel
thank you for your info. i have readmany times on this forum and anuther one about warka bank is it legel to open a acount with warka bank while i am here home in the U. S. so many peeple say no it is not they say i must go to iraq so many peeple say it is ok while i am here home in the U. S. or do i have to go to iraq to open a acount with warka bank and what do you think abowt warka bank thank you JD

-- July 4, 2005 1:41 PM ∞

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Lila wrote:

Hi Johnny,

No, I don't even know how to pump Dinars on E-Bay! I just buy em' and from another site. And as far as what I do for the troups... I'm 49 for the second year now, and believe, as I hinted in my last post, that wars are won and lost with God's help so I pray for the troups. Didn't mean to insult you.

Sara; Thanks for the affirmation and all the good information.

Ed; Thanks, and I did passed it on!

Carl: Or another way to say it; What's down in the well, comes up in the bucket.

Lila

-- July 4, 2005 3:33 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

"You have to love a nation that celebrates its independence every July 4, not with a parade of guns, tanks, and soldiers who file by the White House in a show of strength and muscle, but with family picnics where kids throw Frisbees, the potato salad gets iffy, and the flies die from happiness. You may think you have overeaten, but it is patriotism." (Erma Bombeck)
---

AMERICANISM...

If you want your father to take care of you, that’s ...

paternalism,

If you want your mother to take care of you, that’s ...

maternalism,

If you want comrades to take care of you and everything you do is for the state, that’s...

communism;

If you think "if it feels good do it,"regardless of the consequences or who it might hurt, and are in this thing just for yourself, that’s...

individualism,

If all you care about are your possessions, what you can accumulate in this life and things are more important than people, that’s...

materialism,

If you want Uncle Sam to take care of you, depend on the government for everything, don’t know the difference between entitlements and benefits, and you think they are totally responsible for your well being, then that’s not only stupid, but...

socialism;

But, if you want to take care of yourself, be held responsible for your behavior, hold yourself accountable for your actions, feel a responsibility to be a good and productive citizen, promote the betterment of mankind and bring honor to the greatest country on the face of the earth, then that, my friend, is...

Americanism.

---

"If our country is worth dying for in time of war let us resolve that it is truly worth living for in time of peace." (Hamilton Fish)

---

"Freedom is the oxygen of the soul." (Moshe Dayan)

---

"May the sun in his course visit no land more free, more happy, more lovely, than this our own country!" (Daniel Webster)

---

"Freedom has its life in the hearts, the actions, the spirit of men and so it must be daily earned and refreshed - else like a flower cut from its life-giving roots, it will wither and die." (Dwight D. Eisenhower)

---

"Those who won our independence believed liberty to be the secret of happiness and courage to be the secret of liberty." (Abraham Lincoln)

---

-- July 4, 2005 3:33 PM ∞

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Michael wrote:

I happen to know that it is possible to open an IRAQ bank account. I really do not know why some people really want to do that as I prefer to have dollars or in this case DINARS in hand but, if you do email me an I will give you the link. Just FYI I am also in IRAQ but that has nothing to do with it. You can open it from anywhere.

armynomoorhead@yahoo.com

-- July 4, 2005 4:39 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

MS Rebel,

Friend... your making me blush because all of this attention...

Hey Bud... Thanks for the idea! "Get your red hot Dinars here!".... "Dinars"...."Get your red hot Dinars!"

Outlaw

-- July 4, 2005 5:47 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Oh....One other thing Rebel,

I think the Bank at the Al Rasheed Hotel is the Al Rasheed Bank...not the CBI!

"Get your Red Hot Dinars!"....

Outlaw

-- July 4, 2005 7:59 PM ∞

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JD Pelton wrote:

thank you sara and micheal for yur help
my cousin called the bank of oklahoma they saythey do not deel in dinar. has anybody caled the bank in utah to make sur i was wunder if this is true, thank you JD

-- July 4, 2005 10:53 PM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

Hi All,

My info here is not "insider", but reflects what is being said by others (general consensus);

1)The rate will stay the same until ratification of the Iraqi constitution this fall;

2)The acceptance by the international monetary authorities will happen, after the Iraqi Assembly is elected, and convenes in December;

3) The insurgency is not an issue as far as the value of the dinar, the resumption of oil going out of Iraq,is;

4) The general Kuwaiti banking opinion is that the dinar will peg at .33 - .40, upon its acceptance;

5) The insurgents recent tactic of targeting Islamic diplomats, is their tactic to avoid the Islamic world supporting Iraq as long as the US is on the ground;

6) The price of oil will be the deciding factor in the success of the NID. (Oil export supply factors,not the political situation).

Once again, this is not my opinion. It is the opinion of some successful Kuwaitis, here on the ground.

SGT at SPOD

-- July 5, 2005 7:04 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Sgt at SPOD
Thanks for the info. To me, that type of thinking starts to make sense. I think guessing what the dinar peg value is going to be is like a whistle heard in the wind. Never visble or certain of the tune. Heck! if the GCC countries don't have a clue at this time what their currency value will be in 2010.
Always said, slight movement 2006, somemore 2007,2008 then a major gain starting 2009 when individuals start to see the GCC is actually going to happen with the Iraqi dinar included in the GCC. Good spike in 2010 when the GCC includes the dinar.
Two forces move currency, strength of Economy, and Political. Any major events of those two will move value up or down, depending on event.

-- July 5, 2005 7:28 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Gonzales: FBI to Aid Iraqi Investigations
By MARK SHERMAN,
Associated Press Writer
Sun Jul 3, 4:27 PM ET

Iraq is ready to accept U.S. help in investigating the killing and kidnapping of government officials, U.S. Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said Sunday after a surprise visit amid tight security.

While details still need to be worked out, investigators from the FBI and other U.S. law enforcement agencies would join their Iraqi counterparts at crime scenes and in other aspects of the probes, Gonzales' aides said.

A few senior Justice Department officials accompanied Gonzales, including Max Wood, the U.S. attorney in Macon, Ga., who is beginning a posting as the senior U.S. law enforcement official in Iraq.

More than 400 Justice Department employees and contractors are working to train Iraqi judges, prosecutors, police and prison guards. A separate unit is working with the Iraqi tribunal preparing to try former President Saddam Hussein and others.

Some five dozen FBI agents and analysts are also on assignment in Iraq investigating roadside bombings and other attacks against U.S.-led coalition forces.

Gonzales said the work sends a strong message that the U.S. is determined to find those responsible for the attacks.

"If that follow-up work is not done, you can't promote the rule of law in that environment," he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050703/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/gonzales_iraq_10&printer%3D1

-- July 5, 2005 10:48 AM ∞

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James Pegelow wrote:

I called Zions Bank in Salt Lake City, Utah today.
I was told that while they do trade many foreign currencies, the New Iraqi Dinar is NOT serviced by them at this time. When I asked if she is aware of
any upcoming change that will see them servicing the NIDinar (if and when) she said no but added that that is not something they would have much advance notice on anyway. Sounds like a well run organization (zionsbank.com)

-- July 5, 2005 1:17 PM ∞

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outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Hey Gang,

Just wanted to pass on that I just found out...

I called the main branch of the Zion Bank in Utah. I was connected to their "International Dept." I spoke to a gentleman who told me that at present none of their Banks (Zion) exchanges IQD... BUT... Their Parent Corporation (Bank of America) has advised them that they will be exchanging IQD within 6 months.

So this seems to be inline with Sgt at SPOD's estimation regarding the installation of the new Government.

I agree with MS Rebel...lets all kick back and relax... drink a couple brews... take your shoes off and sit a spell...

"GOOD THING COME TO THOSE WHO WAIT!"

Outlaw

-- July 5, 2005 2:31 PM ∞

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Frankie wrote:

REGARDING THE BANK OF UTAH

I have found out the same thing. They do NOT deal in the NID at this time. What is it with those people over there at investorsiraq giving out BAD information regarding opening domestic bank accounts for the NID. They need to do better about checking their sources over there. I don't blame this forum. You all were just relaying the information. It just ticks me off when I waste my time with doing the correct research like a lot of people on this board do.
I don't do much posting but someone needs to let those people at investorsiraq that if they post something then they need to BACK IT UP!!!
Hey InvestorsIraq, Just the FACTS please.

-- July 5, 2005 3:18 PM ∞

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Frankie wrote:

that was the Zion Bank in Utah that I called.I am so mad that I forgot to mention which bank in Utah that I had called on my last post.

-- July 5, 2005 3:23 PM ∞

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Terrance wrote:

Sara -

Very cool post on Americanism -

Aloha

T-

-- July 5, 2005 6:24 PM ∞

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JB Smith wrote:

Well Frankie
if you're so mad,
why don't you go over to IIF?
That post was made by "SeaBee Can-Do"
who stated that /he/ had opened an account,
and that they would exchange Dinar for Dollar.

So go call him a liar.

Hardly fair to indict an entire forum
of people you apparentlty don't know...
if you wasted more time doing correct research,
you'd know these folks are very concerned with facts.

And,
to clarify,
most domestic bank discussions,
have been posted in the "Rumors" forum.
Not a category where /i/ would look,
if i wanted "just the facts."
.

-- July 5, 2005 10:46 PM ∞

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ShadowMaster wrote:

"The Lord was grieved that he had made man on earth, and his heart was filled with pain." [Gen 6:6]

-- July 6, 2005 8:24 AM ∞

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Johnny Cash wrote:

This Board is such a melting pot of personalities and concepts no one will ever agree with you all of the time no matter how passionate you may be about your cause. The daily bickering about religous views has been played. Please stop! (WWJD?) Everyone of us has a right to his/her own God and Opinion... It's the American way; However keep what's yours to yourself in some cases, this Blog should be about Dinar.

A little while back, I posted that a Coke at the Baghdad Inernational Airport was One UD Dollar or 1000 Dinar and I actually had people try to argue the point as if it were a bad thing. Some of you are so caught up that you only want to argue. Take a deep breath and get ready for a splash of cold water! First let me say that if (today) the Dinar is listed as 1469 to one US Dollar, then that Coke was .66 cents for Iraqis or $1 for anyone paying in dollars. Make cents (Ha?) You already made or saved .33 cents by investing in Iraqi Dinar (if you bought at 1465!)

Now my point is that areas in this country accept the value of dinar as 1000 IQD = 1 USD... which is GOOD News if we were to see a jump like that on Oanda, USDToday, Forex or any of the orher sites that monitor the currencies(It'd be a 33% Gain;) However then what will you do???

The Iraqi Dinar is Pegged to the USD at 1465... The trading banks get more dinar as the US Dollar gets stronger... 1466, 1468, 1471... and so on and as the Iraqi Government and country becomes more stable, the dinar will gain strength and bring it into check. It fluxuates.

Where are you going to cash in your dinar when you have actually made 33% on your money?
Not a "PEG," you need an "Acceptance." Global Recoginition and Acceptance of Iraqi's new currency. (Another thing that get's on my nerves is people using NID as a symbol for IQD. If and when it changes again, will it then be the New-NID?) Please use IQD as the official symbol for Iraqi Dinar unless you are selling it on Ebay.

I'm sure everyone is thinking, "who the heck is this person, with his stupid opinions, misspellings and bad grammer?" Well, I'm with you!! I'm one of the gang, and I have a lot of new IQD, however I want people to place real data on this board!!! Show me the money!

Gambling on a currency and then touting religion to back it up is just not right in my oppinion...
God's gonna getcha back. It just might not be your God when it happens though.

I am convinced that the 25K and 10K notes are a sucker bet! Very few people made a lot of money in Kuwait on the currency flux.

How can this currency possibly open at .33 cents anytime soon with bills like that out there?? Tell me, anyone! You are all nuts if you believe it! The smallest denomination is a 25 dinar coin that no one wants to use. There is also a 100 dinar coin (Niether made of Silver.) At a .33 cent "Peg" the smallest amount in circulation becomes worth $8.25 USD? "Excuse me sir, here is 25K dinar worth $8,250 USD each... I have hundreds of them. I just flew in and I want to open an account at the hotel." Come on. Large bills will be demonitized by the CBI way before they are ever worth anything like that. Sorry.

Please do yourself a favor before you invest anything (or anymore) and read about the laws and regulations at CBIraq.org where it states that they can and will demonitize any denomination at any time that they deem fit to do so.

Also, you all need to figure out where to cash Dinar in and unless you fly to Baghdad, or get on Ebay right now the chances are not too great. Zion Bank Bunk (Dinar Pushers!) I have finally got enough dinar to do my entire (very large) bathroom with in all of the colors. I already have the pattern figured out.

Now- Realistically, I could see the dinar becoming accepted after there is a constitution, maybe. I can see it rising in value on a global exchange to maybe 1 USD = 1000 IQD after another election, Sunni's are more empowered and things stabalize a little (hopefully sooner than later for all of the world's peace!!) I can even foresee the currency perhaps at 1 USD = 500 IQD perhaps oil production resumes this year or early next... down the road a ways!

If and when the Iraqi currency nears ONE PENNY, something will have to give. Stop and think about it there are no One's, Five's, Ten's, or percentages of a single dinar! No coins other than the 25 or 100...

Now to the people on this borad that argue about a "Peg..." admit it... You sell dinar!

The CBI will call the 25K and 10K notes and I pray that the currency is exchangable on a global market but I really don't think so. With a short currency exchange timeline before the notes are worthless, unless you are in Iraq, it's "game over" for you and your investment. Before the dinar climbs, the big denominations will be demonitized... ONLY, in my opinion. Probably the same time the Iraqi Government or CBI will have to release some other smaller bills and coins. Anyone heard anything about that??

Right now with the currency denominations dispersed from a 25 Dinar coin to 25,000 Dinar bill; a PENNY is the most that you can ever pray for; but Before that, pray that there is a place to DUMP IT!

Acceptance, pray that the world will accept the dinar... It's already "Pegged" but who will take it?

It may be a long road to getting your money or investment back! ! ! ! Sorry, my opinion. Chaulk it up as a loss, I say. I've spent more on a party than I have invested. It was a no brainer for me, but I'm here and I can get it changed should and when that time occurs.

I have friends with accounts, and I have money in the market (ISX.) It is through Iraqi citizens. I'm pretty sure it's the only way to do it right now...

PEG......... NO
.33 Cents... NO
ACCEPTANCE.. YES

We want the dinar accepted so we can make a little something off of the game! The real winners/lossers are the people selling for a profit which I'm sure is not or should not be legal.

Get a towel to dry off, sorry about the cold water on the fire... Don't use the towel for tears! Argue differently whenever you're ready.

"Peg..." Get back to work!

-- July 6, 2005 11:54 AM ∞

---

Michael wrote:

Johhny you don't have your facts straight. When you have all the information please come back and post it. Right now you have an opinion, just like everyone else. As far as the denominations go, Just becasue you don't see any smaller denominations does not mean that there are none.

-- July 6, 2005 1:11 PM ∞

---

Terrance wrote:

Memo to Johnny Cash:

You could be right. There is a distinct possibility of your scenario unfolding to the demise of all IQD investors. The question of denomination size does lead one to assume that if the IQD gains significant strength then a new set of IQD currency would need to be produced in much smaller denominations which could spell trouble if US Banks are not trading the currency.

But - if that does happen then that is a good problem to face. It means we will all be experiencing huge gains on our investment. Even if the Dinar is not traded in the US banking system freely there will be mechanisms that arise to allow us to sell. Granted, you may have to pay a higher fee to do it, but the demand for exchanging Dinars in the marketplace will create supply, an avenue of exchange.

So don't fret Johnny Cash - If we have that problem, it will be a good problem to have. We can all talk about how we overcame it at the pig roast in Hawaii -

Out for now -

T-

-- July 6, 2005 3:35 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Johnny,

Nice post...I think you have really out done yourself on this one. Your gonna have the crowed slingin" doo doo for days...

Next, It appears that you must be attracted to foolish ventures like ourselves. But "if" I am to understand your own words... "It is through Iraqi Citizens", then one must omit that investing in the ISX is much more risky.

Will you please tell the crowed how much money this Iraqi Citizen has made off of your investment so far??? Is he passing the profits on to you??? Has he bought a new car yet??? I know...I bet he sent his wife to get liposuction that she has been dreaming of for years!

Outlaw

-- July 6, 2005 5:58 PM ∞

---

Sporter wrote:

Johnny,

I would like for you to answer this very simple question. How will Iraq ever repay debt if the exchange rate is 1460 to 1 ?. Please, we all need your help.

-- July 6, 2005 6:03 PM ∞

---

frankie wrote:

JB Smith,

You said,

"And,
to clarify,
most domestic bank discussions,
have been posted in the "Rumors" forum.
Not a category where /i/ would look,
if i wanted "just the facts."

Well.... DUHHHH!
If you could COMPREHEND what I was saying, you would have known that I was saying "Just the Facts", in other words, no more RUMORS. Or, do I have to spell everything out for you next time? SHEESH! I knew it was a rumor. Didn't you see the link to IIF above my last post? I thought that EVERYONE knew that, even though the poster said he wasn't sure where to post it on IIF. I researched the rumor, and it was bad information. And, bad information is bad information, rumor or no.

And, as far as calling the poster a liar, you call him a "liar". I don't do petty things like that. I don't post to any forums except on this one a few times. Sorry, but I don't have time to jump from one forum to another like you. I have a real life. In fact, I don't want to waste anymore time on this post. But, I will educate you on my last post, if you need any further clarification/assistance, or if you have any further comprehension problems.

-- July 6, 2005 6:23 PM ∞

---

JB Smith wrote:

I think i understand you, Frankie,

and if i understand you correctly,
you are on this forum,
complaining about another forum
at which you do not participate;
you think this forum should not
have a "rumors" section,
and people should not post rumors in it?

And then,
with full knowledge that it was a rumor,
you went and did research,
which would seem to contradict the rumor,
and you are angry with someone else,
because you voluntarily wasted your time
doing your due diligence?

And lastly, you say,
you wouldn't do something so "petty"
as to go over to IIF to call someone a liar,
and yet, as you call his directly related experience
"bad information",
you're content to stay here and call him a liar?

Do i have all that correct?

Myself,
i don't presume to tell anyone else
what they should or shouldn't have on their website,
And, given two apparently conflicting bits of information
from different sources,
i would not presume that either source was the last word,
and i surely wouldn't choose one source for my bias,
and use it to impugn a stranger's veracity.

But that's just me.

Carry on with your comprehension rant if you must,
but i think i understand you well enough.
.

-- July 6, 2005 8:21 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Oh Johnny???

One other thing.... "IF" the Dinar has posted as you state, then how come it's not on the FOREX?

When it "Pegs" or "Opens" then every mom and pop money exchange around the world will be trading it. Once it hits, I bet that coke at the BIAP will cost you 3USD instead of 1USD.

Remember this my friend... that 400USD you invested... Would have given you an extra 560k IQD more than you have now!

"Two birds in the bush don't equal the Dinar in hand!"

Keep you head down and when the Dinar hits...be sure to come to "Boners" in Bangkok and the first rounds on me!

"DINARS!...GET YOUR RED HOT DINARS HERE!"...

Outlaw

-- July 6, 2005 8:27 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Iraq Still in Spotlight at G-8 Summit
Updated: Wednesday, Jul. 6, 2005 - 4:28 PM
By JUDITH INGRAM
Associated Press Writer

GLENEAGLES, Scotland (AP) - Russian President Vladimir Putin will push the Group of Eight to work toward giving the United Nations a leading role in Iraq, a Kremlin official said.

Bush intends to give his G-8 partners an accounting of the course of stabilization, White House officials have said. During a press conference Wednesday in Copenhagen en route to Gleneagles for the summit, Bush strongly defended his decision to go into Iraq.

A senior German government official said his delegation was prepared to discuss Germany's role in police training and "capacity-building" - rebuilding Iraq's ministries.

Despite its opposition to the war, Russia has backed stabilization efforts, repeatedly expressed concern over the continuing violence.

Moscow also appears intent on playing a greater role in Iraq, sending its ambassador to a Baghdad meeting last month with radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr in what Russian officials portrayed as an attempt to widen Russia's dialogue with various political forces. Analysts cast it as a Kremlin attempt to carve out an independent niche.

The Kremlin official, who declined to be identified in accordance with Kremlin press rules, also said the G-8 should work to make the political process in Iraq more inclusive.

That was the recommendation of last month's Brussels meeting on Iraq hosted by the European Union and the United States. Delegates there expressed support for the Iraqi government's efforts toward democratization amid friction between the Shiite Muslim majority and the once politically dominant Sunni Muslim minority.

http://story.iraqsun.com/p.x/ct/9/cid/c31d0aaa23b24a75/id/1b0ff8f22f453ac0/

-----------

Iran vows support to Iraq sovereignty
Big News Network
Wednesday 6th July, 2005 (UPI)

Iranian Defense Minister Ali Shamkhani assured his Iraqi counterpart Wednesday of Iran's readiness to help Iraq restore stability and national sovereignty.

The Iranian News Agency, IRNA, quoted Shamkhani as saying after a first round of talks with Iraqi Defense Minister Saadoun Dalimi, that security and development in both Iran and Iraq help consolidate regional stability.

For this reason, Tehran is ready to place all its resources at the disposal of the Iraqi government in order to restore stability and security, Shamkhani said.

"We support a stable, secure and united Iraq which maintains good neighborly relations with countries of the region," he added.

For his part, Dalimi stressed his country's keenness to build the strongest relations with neighboring Iran.

Damlimi arrived in Tehran Tuesday night on a two-day official visit.

http://story.iraqsun.com/p.x/ct/9/cid/c31d0aaa23b24a75/id/71099533a710bde0/

-- July 6, 2005 10:03 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Take a break.. :)
Here are..
Thoughts that are..
Something Old, Something New,
Something Borrowed, Something Blue (or blue/red, maroon).
:)

---

Noah's Law of Business:

You get remembered for building the Ark - not for predicting the rain!

---

"Do the right thing. It will gratify some people and astonish the rest."

---

"Even a fish will keep out of trouble if it keeps its mouth shut."

---

An open mind is wonderful if a matching mouth doesn't go with it.

---

The real art of conversation is not only to say the right thing in the right place, but also to leave unsaid the wrong thing at the tempting moment.

---

It's not me who can't keep a secret; it's the people I tell that can't. --Abraham Lincoln.

---

Dublin born Richard Brinsley Sheridan was strolling along St. James Street one day when he happened to meet two scions of nobility. "I say, Sherry," commented one of them, "we have just been discussing which you were - a knave or a fool. What is your opinion?" Sheridan took each of them by the arm and replied: "You might say I am between the two!"

---

Scars: Tattoos with better stories.

------

"Save our planet...it's the only one with chocolate!"

---

Money may not talk, but its absence screams.

---

Tact is the rare ability to stay silent while two friends are arguing and you're certain they are both wrong.

---

To speak ill of others is a dishonest way of praising ourselves.

---

"The Maple Sugar Makers Association in Vermont is sending hundreds of gallons of genuine maple syrup over to our troops in Iraq. Soldiers say the syrup will go towards the creation of WMDs - Waffles of Mass Deliciousness."

Dennis Miller

---

If you think nobody cares about you, don't file a federal tax return this year.

---

Resentment is like taking poison and hoping the other person dies - ST.AUGUSTINE -

---

How to wipe out an atheist: Serve him a meal and then ask him if he believes there is a cook.

----

At a job interview, an aspiring applicant was asked a question in an attempt to gain insight into his personality: "If you could spend an evening conversing with anybody living or dead, whom would you choose?" He responded, without pausing a moment, "The living one."

---

Sign in a travel agency window: "Please go away."

----

Our generation never got a break. When we were young they taught us to respect our elders. Now that we're older, they tell us to listen to the youth of the country.

----

"Feeling gratitude and not expressing it is like wrapping a present and not giving it." - William Arthur Ward

---

The real reason that we can't have the Ten Commandments in a Courthouse:

You cannot post "Thou Shalt Not Steal," "Thou Shalt Not Commit Adultery" and "Thou Shall Not Lie" in a building full of lawyers, judges and politicians...

It creates a hostile work environment.

----

"We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." -Benjamin Franklin

---

Don't accept your dog's admiration as conclusive evidence that you are wonderful.

---

What is the difference between inlaws and outlaws?

Outlaws are wanted!!!

---

"If you step on people in this life, you're going to come back as a cockroach." (Willie Davis)

---

A guy gets shipwrecked. When he wakes up, he's on a beach. The sand is dark red.

He can't believe it. The sky is dark red. He walks around a bit and sees there is dark red grass, dark red birds and dark red fruit on the dark red trees. He's shocked when he finds that his skin is starting to turn dark red too.

"Oh no!!" he says. "I think I've been marooned!!"

---

Happiness is found along the way, not at the end of the road.

---

Don't skinny dip with snapping turtles.

---

Everyone is beautiful if you squint a bit.

---

Men like to barbecue. Men will cook if danger is involved.

---

:)

-- July 6, 2005 10:38 PM ∞

---

(MS)Mississippi Rebel wrote:

I just spent a while enjoying all the wonderful posts. I see that Johnny Cash seems to have pushed some buttons. Just thought you guys would like to know that Iran has agreed to work with Iraq to construct a pipeline between the contries so Iran can refine the Iraqi Oil. That is some more good news.

So what is up with all the talk of religon lately? I thought this was for Dinar discussion.
Continue to keep the Dinar talk up. I usually take time to review and follow up on some of the information given out here.

So in the words of OUTLAW....Get your red hot Dinars.... Top of the page... 25,000 dinars for 25 bucks! What a deal! That is a $8.00 profit for the seller. Hey I guess if you want it bad enough you will pay the price.

MS REBEL

-- July 7, 2005 12:43 AM ∞

---

okie wrote:

"Outlaw"......

Read your comment about Bangkok and it made me remember that I leave for Bangkok tomorrow on the big bird....yeh right, like I haven't had my bag packed for about three days now.
I'll check this site every day to see what's going on. In the meantime...everyone should take a deep breath, get back on their medication and just remember that when the Dinar takes off we will have many ways to convert it to USD. For people in Iraq, the haji shop that sold it to us will be more than happy to convert back to USD, for a small fee thrown in. Gotta go now...I'm getting day visions about Thailand.

-- July 7, 2005 2:22 AM ∞

---

Johnny Cash wrote:

Michael, Facts? listed on the CBI site is the following with pictures: (cut and paste)

25 DINAR COIN

FRONT

is asmooth round shaped coin made of copper plated steel made wuth a diammeter of 17.5 mlm and weight 2 grams it cotains acecle with the denomination of the coin inside at the top the phrase of central bank of iraq and at the bottom the deuomination of the coin in writing


25 DINAR COIN

BACK

the map of Iraq with two dates Hegira , 1425 and A.d.,2004


100 DINAR COIN

FRONT

is a jagged round shaped coin made of nickel plated steel metal with a diameter of 22 mlm and weighs 4.3 gram cotains acecle with the denomination of the coin inside at the top the phrase of central bank of iraq and at the bottom the deuomination of the coin in writing

100 DINAR COIN

BACK

the map of Iraq with two dates Hegira , 1425 and A.d.,2004

Sorry Mike! post something else... Show me the money, there are no other coins (1's, 5's, 10's or otherwise!) I began that post as "my" opinion. You must be able to argue your point my fellow carbon based life form. Obviously not a Couselor who's passed the bar. Perhaps you are in sales... Dinar anyone?

Outlaw, I can not confirm nor deny that the little bit I sent through a friend who has a friend who is Iraqi has not bought a black Mercedes or taken a trip or used the money for something devious, however my friend is accountable and will be paying me back should the circumstance arise... I want stock certificates in hand whether or they have someone else's name on them or not! The jury is still out and I may get stuck! I have writen it off for now, but what if!!! It's the same gamble as the dinar. Before they charge three bucks for a Coke, they've got to paint the walls and change the carpet. It's the first thing you see when you get here and the last thing you see when you leave... I think that first and last impressions are Everything!

Sportster, "you tell me" how Iraq will pay off the indebtedness to the world with an exchange rate of 1460... Debt forgiveness is what I've been reading in the news because they can not. Perhaps "Debt for Oil." It's not something that I claim to be an expert on... Are you? You tell me what you think. Perhaps the profits from demonitizing the 25K and 10K notes that they can keep when you can't find a place to exchange them and you are all stuck with wall paper. Sportster, I do not know. Good question... Are they paying the debt now? "Dinar anyone?"

Forex??? It's not accepted... if it were, today the CBI probably says between 1455-1475 to the dollar.

The site I enjoy looking at daily which gives promise is the Trade Bank of Iraq's site. It's very clean and lists the names of global entities that are investing in the country as well as progress. TBIraq.com has a lot including news. It's a very nice source for the progress in Iraq. JP Morgan is the big player with National banks all over the world... I think it even includes China.

I do not claim to have the answers, I'm posing rebuttals to a little stupidity. Post about the dinar... I'm in but it's a LONG road to prosperity.

Go Dinar but "Show me the money!!!"

-- July 7, 2005 3:37 AM ∞

---

SGT at SPOD wrote:

Hi Board,

If one thing is for certain, its that one definate American trait is impatience.

I haven't invested in the IQD/NID. I have invested in the Iraqui stock market with some Kuwaiti friends. I monitor this site for any info that may impact on the Iraqi Exchange. Any info that I've put out is generally an opinion of some very successful people who got their start by investing in Kuwait after Desert Storm. They didn't just invest in currency, but in construction, engineering, and the infrastucture as a whole....They covered the whole board. And then they waited. All of them showed a very large profit for their patience.

I think there's a lot of wishful thinking, sub-consious anticipation, and some feelings of trepidation, concerning the dinar being displayed on the board. The future value will probably not be as rosy as some portray, but will be profitable.

I will continue to address any concerns or questions that anyone here would like asked of my connections in Kuwait, and I promise to only convey the info as it is portrayed to me. No wishful thinking, no distortion of the facts, no sub-concious hopes. If I can stress any point, it would be that homework, communication, and common sense will take care of the future (If you need any further confidence, go talk to a investment banker, or counselor,and ask his opinion).

SGT at SPOD

-- July 7, 2005 4:44 AM ∞

---

riddler wrote:

okay true belivers,
tells look at the big picture we all know that there is an electon coming soon. Well riddle me this Batman. if you are elected "prime minister" of a country or a "political leader" would you want to be paid in a currency that you can only use in your country? I think not. any one care to retort.

-- July 7, 2005 6:38 AM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

SGT at SPOD
Well said. Patience or commitment to long term struggles do not seem to be traits that we present americans handle very well. "We want it now" should be the motto flying on a banner, like a military units colors.

-- July 7, 2005 7:17 AM ∞

---

Johnny Cash wrote:

I believe the Oil producing countries like to be paid in USD. Maybe some accept Euros... But Platinum, Gold, Silver and a lot of hard convertible currency like US dollars would be the fiat of choice to hold in the National or Republic Reserves. If you are a counrty that has a currency less desirable, I think to pay for the Oil, it must be changed into US dollars and then you can pay the debt. I'm not possitive, but look it up... Not a chance of being a Prime Minister though.

-- July 7, 2005 8:31 AM ∞

---

Michael wrote:

I want you to read as well as comprehend Dear Johnny-

Johhny you don't have your facts straight. When you have all the information please come back and post it. Right now you have an opinion, just like everyone else. As far as the denominations go, Just becasue you don't see any smaller denominations does not mean that there are none.

-- July 7, 2005 10:46 AM ∞

---

Johnny Cash wrote:

Michael-
What are the denominations? How can I get some? Please enlighten all of us with you all seeing eye of wisdom. What are the facts, Michael? Can you "Show me the Money?"
Hmm... My opinion is that you are finatical and arguementative. If you let us know where the lower denominations are, I will post an apology and stand corrected. Thanks.

-- July 7, 2005 12:14 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

In light of the 911 type attack on London England today, July 7th, this July 3 article which quotes the Iraqi PM now appears to be be very prophetic:

“Iraqis are battling terror on behalf of the whole world,” the prime minister added, warning that “car bombs can be exported everywhere.”

As can subway bombs.. and suicide bombers (apparently the double decker bus was blown up by a suicide bomber) as well as other terror.

Unless we engage and win against them now in the Iraqi theatre, it will come home to haunt each one of us (and our loved ones). The next threats from the terrorists were to Italy and Denmark, the news services say:

"The group claimed the attack in a Web site posting and warned Italy and Denmark to withdraw troops from those two countries." http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161768,00.html

President Bush's recent address was correct to connect the extremists from 911 to Iraq. Just as the ideology of Communism once threatened the free world, so now a new extremist jihad ideology threatens all free democracies. It is best not to stand quietly and let it fester and grow peacefully, plotting their terror against us in the dark, but confront it.

Our efforts in Iraq have only made it come above ground; we did not create it, as President Bush said, WE were attacked in 911, and this was a response to that. Don't forget that attack on 911. We have only made it show itself by our efforts in Iraq. The threat was already there, festering and growing. This didn't create Jihad extremists, they were already trained and ready to attack. Ignoring the threat will not help any of us at this point in history.

And YES, this affects the fortunes of Iraq, and the Dinar. Of course.

Sara.
----

Attacks on elite Iraqi units kill 19; wound more than 50
(AFP)
3 July 2005

BAGHDAD - Two suicide bomb attacks directed at elite Iraqi police units killed 19 people, wounding more than 50, underscoring Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari’s message to parliament leaders that “the tree of liberty will be watered with blood.”

Jaafari, in an address to leaders of the parliament’s Shiite-dominated United Iraqi Alliance, said: “The Iraqi nation is giving its dearest and its blood to defend humanity.

“Let the whole world and the countries of the region know that it is a battle of values and principles and not a matter of resistance and occupation.”

He referred to Iraqi insurgent claims of resisting US-led occupation forces.

“Iraqis are battling terror on behalf of the whole world,” the prime minister added, warning that “car bombs can be exported everywhere.”

With blows to Iraq’s security forces a daily occurrence, Jaafari said US-led troops should not leave Iraq until the country was ready to stand on its own.

“We look forward to multinational forces leaving but the timing must take into account national interests and not be dictated by terrorists,” he said. “The timing must be Iraqi.”

Elsewhere, a doctor who participated in seizing hostages and interrogating them has been captured by Iraqi forces, the US military said.

“Security forces captured Safa Ali Chiad Mashoul, aka (also known as) Doctor Moshen and Abu Saif, during a raid in the Baghdad area on June 21,” a statement said.

But US forces released Mohammed Tabtabai Hakim, an aide to Moqtada Sadr who had been arrested and imprisoned more than a year ago during a bloody rebellion led by the radical Shiite cleric, a member of Sadr’s movement said.

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/July/focusoniraq_July11.xml§ion=focusoniraq&col=

-- July 7, 2005 12:14 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Okie,

I'm glad to hear that your going to Thailand...I hope you have a fantastic time. I will be there on the 31st of this month. When the dinar comes in, I am going to buy a club in Bkk and retire there. This will be my third R&R there.

Again, my friend...be safe...and don't forget to wear your raincoat. hehe

Outlaw

-- July 7, 2005 1:56 PM ∞

---

Michael wrote:

http://www.cbiraq.org/cbs5.htm

There are the denominations that are currently in circulation Johnny. I am neither finatical or arguementative. I just realize that the powers that be could have thought ahead at some point. All I am saying is that just because we can't see it at this point doesn't mean that it isn't there. OK??

-- July 7, 2005 6:21 PM ∞

---

Johnny Cash wrote:

Michael-
If you say so. I'm on the streets in Baghdad and no one seems to know of anything less than the very unpopular 25 dinar coin. The 50 dinar paper is being used as the lowest denomination and if you can acquire any, the notes are very used and worn out. The 50 is currently valued and used as a nickel. If you can post another amount for everyone to be aware of, or you can post a source that references something to the contrary about to be released, I will stand corrected. Until then, you are correct in noting that it's just my humble opinion. Everyone is aware of that. Enjoy your freedom to express your opinion, right or wrong.

Go Dinar!

-- July 8, 2005 12:04 AM ∞

---

Jimmy P wrote:

3 Points For The Roundtable:
1. How are all of the contractors that are
rebuilding Iraq being paid? Is it Iraqi Dinar?
2. I personally appreciate ties to biblical things
that deplore some folks on this board. Thanks
you Sara M for all you do!
3. Johnny Cash, I buy bigger bills, do you have
some for sale?

-- July 8, 2005 4:26 AM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

WELL ! SHOULD WE SCRATCH OUR WATCH OR WIND OUR A-- REGARDING THIS COUNTRY?

15 out of the 19 were___________
Some say the Wahhabi ideology is stronger and more controlling than the taliban, yet are given complete power in ____________________
Forbes magazine says their leader,________ is worth $60 billion, yet $60.00 a barrel will not solve their financial problems because of widespread poverty, chronic unemployment, unbridled corruption and a health care system that is falling around their knees.

Before the Iraq war the projection of $18 a barrel deficit was real, now the country of ____________ laughs all the way to the bank with $60.00 a barrel plus depending on the events.

The country of __________is reaping rewards of an all time oil prices.

Some 60 % of the sucide bombers in the Iraqi insurgency are sent from______________.

They play the double game.The ________________ are tickled pink that the ole US of A is mired down in the iraqi quick sand, and will add more water to the slush, if it appears things are getting too solid.

______________is the most repressive country in the middle east with no tolerance of any other faith, journalists sacked and deported who do not write of their country in a favorable light, spend more money with the Washington elite than any country, refuse basic rights to a majority of their citizens.

Yet Washington Elites who fill their pockets with oil money, sing the old chorus together that _______ is our strongest ally in the middle east.

Despite all of this,the US of A still support___________ with billions of dollars in advance weapons of war. Kind of reminds you of the support we gave the corrupt leaders of Iran, before its take off of the extreme shia.

________________knows as long as Iraqi oil is off of the market the price of oil will remain high.They also fear democratic freedom and worst of all relaxation of religious freedom for other faiths in Iraqi, for this would set a precedent which will filter into their country.

Surely you have guessed by now who I am talkiing about.

The Country Saudi Arabia and the Saudi's have everything to gain, by the continued turmoil in Iraq. So are they Friend, Allie or Brutus with a hand behind the back, holding a knife waiting for us to turn our back?

Fiqured it out yet????

-- July 8, 2005 8:14 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Thanks, Jimmy P... :)
Kind words.
I thought this worth noting for news. :)

Arab League cancels 70% of Iraq's debts
Wednesday, July 06, 2005

(MENAFN) The Arab League signed an agreement with Iraq to cancel 70 percent of Iraq's debts to the League, KUNA reported. The agreement stipulates that the remaining 30 percent would be paid off in equal installments for a period of 10 years beginning January 1, 2007. This arrangement with Iraq was first approved by Arab foreign ministers at a meeting in March 2004. The ministers at that meeting requested the Arab League to handle Iraqi arrears to the League and other Pan-Arab organizations, said the source that preferred anonymity. The idea behind it was to give special consideration for Iraq's ordeal throughout the 1990s, which made it impossible for the country to meet its financial obligations. Iraq, on its part, has shown willingness to settle its debts by offering to pay as a start 50 percent of its dues to the Arab League for 2005 and 2006. Iraq's annual dues are about $3.5 million out of the League's total annual budget of $35 million.

http://www.tbiraq.com/menafn_news_bl.asp?inc_name=news_details&n_id=99078

-- July 8, 2005 11:45 AM ∞

---

Michael wrote:

I am in IRAQ as well Johnny. I have been here 18 months. I see as well as you see my friend. You seem to want to be the arguementative one here. I am simply trying to look ahead. I think that everything has been planned for some time. I also think that they may introduce some smaller denominations at some point. Thank you so much for the ability to express myself. I don't know what I would have done without your blessing kind sir.

-- July 8, 2005 1:08 PM ∞

---

keithatknb wrote:

wow, i just read the whole blog for the first time, guys you gotta hold this iqd for a while to see a profit. i mean, it shouldnt be an investment, currency is never a good investment, too unpredictable. but if you spend an amount of money that you wouldnt mind losing in a casino, then its a good bet, but still a bet. i bought a million iqd ( $680.00), thats what i wouldnt mind losing if the damn govt folds and the money goes under-worst case scenario. anything made on that is profit, and i'm not the type to say " i shoulda bought more, i coulda had more" if it pans out its a good bet and we'll all profit relative to our risk. anyway, i'm estimating a wait of at least 5 years to cash in. just a hunch. hope you all can wait!good luck!

-- July 8, 2005 2:10 PM ∞

---

Frankie wrote:

JB Smith,

"Comprehension rant"? I "must" continue. You are still not getting it right after two times.
I will enlighten/educate you a little more. Why must I waste my time with you, JB Smith? Because, I like to help the uneducated amongst us here at T & B. Maybe, something will light up, and you will COMPREHEND it better this time.

JB Smith said, "And then,
with full knowledge that it was a rumor,
you went and did research,
which would seem to contradict the rumor,
and you are angry with someone else,
because you voluntarily wasted your time
doing your due diligence?"

A rumor is an unverified report usually spread by word-of-mouth. Of course, I did "research".
It was an unverified report. Do you research unverified reports? Or, do you just lay around, and wait for someone else to spoon-feed it to you? Remember that a rumor is not necessarily a lie, JB Smith. Can you remember that?
And, of course, I got mad about the bad info that I discovered through research. Was I supposed to be HAPPY because this was bad information? Do you get a clue yet, or are you still clueless?

JB Smith said, "Myself,
i don't presume to tell anyone else
what they should or shouldn't have on their website,
And, given two apparently conflicting bits of information
from different sources,
i would not presume that either source was the last word,
and i surely wouldn't choose one source for my bias,
and use it to impugn a stranger's veracity."

Did you call Zions Bank? I did.
And, why would I need another source IN THIS CASE? I called the bank directly. And, did I say that I used only one source for research. Noooo, I didn't. Check, and you will see that I said that, "I don't POST to any forums except on this one a few times". It is in one of the paragraphs in my last post. Did I state my "bias" for research? Noooo, I didn't. COMPREHEND before you type. And, as far as impugning a "stranger's veracity", IIF will survive. If you are worried about IIF's veracity, why would I go over there and call someone a liar? But, you can. Help youself. That is too petty for me.

And, change your sentences to where you don't make a declaration, and then ask a question all in the same sentence (if you could call it a sentence). That annoys me. But, that's just me.
Normally, that wouldn't bother me, but you have a bad habit in doing this frequently.

If you have any more questions, bring them on. And, if you are still clueless, I can take the time to give you some MORE help. That's just me. Do yourself a favor. GET A CLUE, and COMPREHEND.

-- July 8, 2005 7:44 PM ∞

---

JB Smith wrote:

Sorry Frankie but i didn't understand a word you said.

.

-- July 8, 2005 9:24 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Rumor Post:

JB Smith and Frankie...

The "rumor board" post was unverifiable, no matter which thread it had been posted on. It was not a rumor, but told as an EXPERIENCE. The poster said this had happened to them, that they had DONE that (picked up Dinars at a Bank). The post was not reporting a rumor, but appeared to be fact. I therefore think that it is irrelevant as to which thread (rumor or not) it was posted on. IF it was incorrect information, the person did lie. It is more likely to my mind that it was truth and the Bank got scared and decided not to say it was selling Dinar AFTER having truly sold some to the poster. I know people personally who had that happen to them with another Bank (I won't name it since they got scared off and would not say publicly they sold it, but they did, I have seen the receipts). So, as for it being a wrong rumor, I think it could easily have been correct, but not true anymore. In any case the Zion bank DID say that within 6 months they will be dealing in Dinars.. so none of us will have to go to Iraq to cash in, if that is so.
Quote:
"... none of their Banks (Zion) exchanges IQD... BUT... Their Parent Corporation (Bank of America) has advised them that they will be exchanging IQD within 6 months."
from: http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12627

Sara.

-- July 8, 2005 10:12 PM ∞

---

JB Smith wrote:

"IF it was incorrect information, the person did lie."

If-then

My point precisely.

That, and Frankie seems to be a very angry person.

I choose not to comprehend such
generalized enmity,
feels like a symptom
of ill times.

I mean good grief
i could arouse his ire
by declaring this sentence,
(if you call this a sentence),
to be an interrogative?
.

And i think IIF
has the right to run their forum
as they please;
Quote:
"Most of what you read in this sub-forum is probably not true."

No sense getting angry then...
personally i do my due diligence
independently,
as my duty to myself,
and my emotions are my sovereign territory.

Not posted to Sara
or anyone else in particular,
especially not Frankie
since Frankie's too angry at my lack of comprehension
to try to comprehend me.

Just a general observation
since i likely won't be here
to witness Frankie's next tantrum.

God Bless you all,
may you prosper in life and love,
neverminding where you find your Dinar
or not,
may your happiness fall from the sky
like manna,

JB

-- July 9, 2005 9:19 AM ∞

---

RON wrote:

Hi all,just a line to let all know that i am still here and reading posts everyday.I wish the U.N.would get on the wagon here and help these Iraqi people after all they are a country that has ties with them.The U.N.military needs to suport the U.S. and all the other countries that are in Iraq to show the insergents that the world in a whole,will not put up with this any longer.
Good luck to all and Iraq.Ron

-- July 9, 2005 11:58 AM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

No bank will be exchanging dinars in six months. Please lets us stop pumping this dinar. The only ones making money are the ones that are selling. I consider my purcahse a lost.

The iraq will change thier currency again and that will be that.

I am now putting on my vest for all the attacks i will get.

-- July 9, 2005 2:05 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Johnnyavedinar,

I'll buy all you got if it will stop all the childish bull....! How much you got???

Outlaw

-- July 9, 2005 3:19 PM ∞

---

Aaron wrote:

This was about facts or fiction which ever you decide to believe. Now it is a bunch of goof balls arguing. Can we please cut the crap, and get back to posting articles that may help us formulate our own opinions. If you want to argue do it somewhere else. Johnnyavedinar, Outlaw, Johnny Cash. Go somewhere else with the bickering please. Post articles not arguments please. I liked this forum until about 1 week ago. Now it is junk. ARTICLES!!!!!

-- July 9, 2005 3:39 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Everyone must uunderstand that the situtation here in Iraq has gone from somewhat bad to extreamly worse over the past month or so, ever since the Baghdad offinsive began. This is actually a good thing..."Inorder to fight your enemy one must know who their enemy is". With all the carbombings and suicide bombings that have occured, the Iraqi Government haad no choice but to commit to a full scale offensive. This offensive has caused the insurgents who had safe haven within the city to be pushed out into the open to either fight or to flee across the borders to other countries.

Times now are in a very critical stage for the country of Iraq. This country was devistated during the invasion by the invading forces and what wasn't distroyed by those forces are now being distroyed by insurgents or locals because of anger towards the insurgents or frustration towards the ability of their government to control the insurgency.

Remember the L.A. riots during the Rodney King thing? Remember how gangs were roaming the streets of L.A. beating and killing people? Remember how people were so frustrated because they felt so strong in their beliefs that they would burn their homes or their neighborhood businesses because of them? I do! Iraq is going through the same thing now but it is country wide not just isolated to a city like L.A. This sounds extreamly hopeless but it isn't.... I can see that the people are starting to wise up and realize that they are only hurting themselves and the future of their children and are helping by directing troops to the insurgent hide-outs. This is war! There is no doubt about it...Iraq is at war! All the things that are occuring here are typical things that occur in war! Is it slowing down the progress of the Dinar? Absolutly! Is the actions that the Iraqis are taking to stop the insurgency helping? Absolutly! I am a soon to be multi-millionair because of my convictions to help secure their freedom by comming to Iraq? Absolutly! Am I going to be a millionair tomorrow? Absolutly not! Next month? Next year? Two Years? Who knows when...but it will happen!

President Bush and the Coalation Forces determined that the most effective way to distroy Al-Qaida was to invade Afghanistan. This created two disastrous situtations for Al-Qaida, the first was that it effectively closed all of their training/operational bases within the Middle East and secondly, shutting-down all of their illegal drug operations which was a major source of funding. I beleive that General Frank left a specific route of escape for Al-Qaida out of Afghanistan either to Iran or through Iran into Iraq. Imagine the horror of Saddam and the government of Iran when all these extreamists came flooding into their country like refugee's without a home! I'm sure that it was a direct threat to their governments and not something they wanted. They would be like the in-laws coming to live with you... their amusing to watch the irritating things that they do to other people, but you don't want them living with you! I think that Iraq is the place that Al-Qaida has been cornered and this is where they will be defeated.

Again my friends, Understand that we are at war here in Iraq and as much as we want our Dinar to make us rich, It will not until we defeat al-Qaida here in the sand. Lets hope that the people of Iraq and their neighbors realize how much of an advantage it is to everyone to get rid of this cancer once and for all.

Outlaw

-- July 9, 2005 6:23 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Aaron...I got some goof balls for you my friend... I see you don't comprehend to well either!

Outlaw

-- July 9, 2005 7:26 PM ∞

---

Bruceleeroy wrote:

How can you travel into Baghdad? We will need this information in case they try to change the currency again.

I know that those with 5mil+ of dinar will take the chance and try to get it exchanged.

-- July 9, 2005 8:02 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Good Work!!

Thanks for the report from the frontlines, Outlaw.
I thought this report from the frontlines also very positive and quite encouraging. Due to the troops and good strategy, blessing and help from above and the continued help of those Iraqis who wish to secure a future and a hope for themselves and their families, the threats to Baghdad have been "mostly eliminated". :)
Sara.
---
U.S. Commander: Insurgents Dealt Sharp Blow
Friday, July 08, 2005

WASHINGTON — U.S. and Iraqi forces have "mostly eliminated" the ability of insurgents to conduct sustained, high-intensity attacks in Baghdad, the top U.S. commander in the Iraqi capital said Friday.

There were 14 to 21 car bombings per week in Baghdad before the May 22 start of the U.S. portion of the latest offensive, dubbed Operation Lightning, he said. That has dropped to about seven or eight a week now, Webster said, attributing the improvement to the disruption of insurgent cells and the availability of more and better intelligence.

"There are some more threats ahead," he said. "I do believe, however, that the ability of these insurgents to conduct sustained, high-intensity operations as they did last year, we've mostly eliminated that."

He predicted that, "in the next couple of months we will not see sustained, long bloody months in Baghdad."

Webster painted a remarkably positive picture of the prospects for improving security in Baghdad. By October, when Iraqis are scheduled to vote on a new constitution, there should be a full division of Iraqi army soldiers, numbering about 18,000, sufficiently trained to take the lead in securing the Iraqi capital, he said.

There are now about 15,000 Iraqi soldiers, in various stages of training, in the Baghdad area that Webster commands. Of those, about one-third are sufficiently trained to control territory in the capital city, he said.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161935,00.html

-- July 9, 2005 9:46 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

How important is Iraq to al Qaeda?
It is THE CENTRAL battle to them and their ideology.
If it were in the days of the Cold War,
and we knew it was THE CENTRAL battle for Communism,
would we not rally behind our fighters?
Sara.
---

National Security Watch: Iraq insurgency vital to al Qaeda
Posted 6/22/05
By David E. Kaplan

How important is the Iraq insurgency to al Qaeda? It is now "the central battle" being waged by Osama bin Laden's terrorist network, according to a just-released report on al Qaeda's ideology by the Congressional Research Service. The study, as with other CRS reports, is distributed only to members of Congress. Titled "Al Qaeda: Statements and Evolving Ideology," the 16-page work is an updated review of al Qaeda statements since 1991 and notes that recent statements by al Qaeda Iraq chief Abu Musab Zarqawi and military leader Sayf al Adl both point to Iraq as an opportunity to spread their movement deeper into the heart of the Arab world. In a December audiotape, bin Laden himself referred to Iraq as the key battle in a "Third World War, which the Crusader-Zionist coalition began against the Islamic nation."

With much of its leadership killed or captured and bin Laden thought to be hiding along the Pakistani border, al Qaeda is not the threat it once posed. But these latest missives from its leaders, taken together, suggest that the terrorist group behind 9/11 remains a worrisome threat. They appear designed to broaden their movement's appeal, gain material support, and "inspire new and more systematically devastating attacks," says the report, written by CRS Middle East analyst Christopher Blanchard. The study stresses to members of Congress the importance of a May statement by al Adl that outlines a "detailed strategic framework for the jihadist movement." Al Adl, thought to be detained in Iran, advises followers in Iraq and elsewhere to steep their groups in Islamic thought, backed by "a circle of judicious men and scholars"; to perform fewer "random" actions; and to better integrate short-term acts into long-term strategies.

The varied statements make up what the report calls "a sophisticated public relations and media campaign" over the past decade, one that has grown in importance in recent years. All told, they suggest that the movement's key goals remain unaltered and uncompromising, notes Blanchard: the expulsion of foreign forces and influences from Islamic lands, and the creation of a pan-Islamic state ruled by Koranic law.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/050622/22insurgency.htm?track=rss

-- July 10, 2005 10:45 AM ∞

---

Aaron wrote:

Outlaw. I just was tired of all the back and forth junk. Your last post was great. By the way. I comprehend better than most my friend.

-- July 10, 2005 2:40 PM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Bruceleeroy...

My friend, I am speculating that "if" the time does come for us to turn in our current Dinar, there will be many places that we will be able to trade for the new currency.

I believe that places accessable to Americans like Dubai, UAE will probably be a good place to go if there is none in the U.S. I also believe that much more Dinar is being sold right here in the Middle East than throughout the world as a whole. I can't see the Iraqi's screwing their neighbors by not allowing some sort of outlet for them to swap for the new currency...it's just not a good policy for trust.

There's always going to be the black market for anything that will bring a profit. Besides even if we do have to pay a percentage to become rich... It is an expense I am willing to pay... Aren't you?

I think that the most important thing to do right now is to buy as much as you can afford, because I do believe the window of opportunity is slowly closing on the procrastinators and the non-believers.

Arron... Understood my friend.

Sara... Thanks and "right back at ya!"

Outlaw.

-- July 10, 2005 4:50 PM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Well the pump and dump continues. Well for al i know we are all in iraq.

-- July 10, 2005 10:24 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

It does appear to be an ideology the free world (and Iraq) is facing, not a single people group.
(Islamic Jihadist Terrorist ideology.)
It seems to cross racial barriers, like Communism or Hitler's third reich did.
Would you have suspected ASIANS of plotting the London terrorist attacks?
Sara.
---
Could London bombers be British Asians?
Daily Star staff
Saturday, July 09, 2005

LONDON: The terrorist attack on London is feared to have been masterminded by a new breed of terrorists - young, well-educated British Asians loyal to Osama bin Laden, the British newspaper The Sun reports.

Allegations are emerging that a terror cell based in the British Midlands is suspected of being behind the 4.5 kilogram bombs that destroyed three London Underground carriages and a double-decker bus on Thursday.

The group of Muslim extremists, composed mostly of former students in their 20s, have had their homes watched for months, but there has not been enough evidence to arrest them, The Sun wrote.

Intelligence agents have reportedly monitored calls between the members and Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan.

A U.S. security source said: "The suspected cell is not the only one being looked at but is one of the most serious lines of inquiry. The suspects are British - disaffected graduates who graduated in the U.K., then went to Islamic schools in Pakistan, near the Afghan border."

Security services tried to locate the gang Thursday following the attacks, but it is understood not all could be found.

Terror expert Professor Michael Clarke of King's College London, said planting a string of bombs would require a cell of 18 to 20 people.

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=10&categ_id=2&article_id=16631

-- July 11, 2005 12:27 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

This article by Wesley K. Clark - a retired general and former Democratic presidential candidate and Supreme Allied commander of NATO - had some good points toward winning this War On Terror here and abroad. Some of the points are global in scope and could help to stabilize Iraq. That in turn would definitely help with the Economic fortunes of the Iraqi people, and the Dinar. :)
Sara.
---

As the follow-up reports emerge from the strikes on the London transit system, it's not too early to begin drawing the implications for our own security efforts.

Fighting terrorism at home isn't just a matter of “killing terrorists.” Terrorists aren't born that way. They are created by their interaction with their surroundings. To win this war, we must defeat the ideology of terrorism, depriving angry young people of their ability to justify their hateful actions in the name of Allah.

This will require not only strong Islamic condemnation of terrorists and their acts, but also a winning dialogue within Islam to defeat Koranic interpretations seeking to justify the use of force against innocent people. We need to encourage “moderates” in Islam to debate, to proselytize and to win over potential terrorists. They are the only ones who can do it.

In the meantime, attention and resources must protect not just the airlines but also U.S. mass transit, rail and other infrastructure.

And we are long overdue in forming a volunteer civil defense effort that would not only strengthen our security but also give Americans an opportunity to contribute. Volunteers would be recruited to serve part time on an unpaid basis. They would be trained in emergency response, security procedures and assist in a terrorist incident. By extending full-time emergency and response skills into every neighborhood, it would provide an “official” channel for education, warning and communications within each community.

In addition, the London attacks remind us how much more devastating even decentralized terrorist strikes could be were they to have employed biological, chemical or radiological weapons. The most profound threat we face is a nuclear weapon in the hands of terrorists.

The United States will win the war on terror when we bring to bear all the elements of our power — not just our military might, civilian workforce and diplomatic skills, but also the power to persuade our allies in general and those in the Muslim community specifically to engage the culture of hate and terror and change it to reflect the best in all of us.

Both here at home and in the global community, there can be no spectators in winning the war against terror.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050711/opcom11.art.htm

-- July 11, 2005 2:55 PM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

DINARMERCHANT.COM - there were previous postings about this site being a rip-off. They gave me the run around for about a week. Finally, told the dude Samir that I was calling the US Department of Treasury on his ass. They are Fedexing a refund check to me today with a Tracking # - maybe this will help somebody else out there.

Peace.

-- July 11, 2005 3:24 PM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Read a scary post on another board about(Dropping Zeroes). Is this a legitimate concern? I dont pretend to understand it fully but from what I took out of it Iraq would essentially drop a few zeroes off 25,000 NID note and make it worth a 250 NID note for various reasons.

-- July 11, 2005 3:41 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

GEORGEWOOD;

Hang in there and don't let fear get hold of you. There are bunches of folks out there with nothing to back up their claims but hot air. Dropping zeroes hasn't come from the upper levels downward, but from some armchair sceptic.. of which there are lots of em. Remember that:
"Some people have minds like blotters: They soak up everything but get it all backward."

And, as the terrorists have found, it is easier to destroy than to build up. Negativism feeds on itself. If you cross all the bridges before you get there, what happens when you get there and find there wasn't a river to cross? Fretting about 20 negative scenerios is not productive of your time, effort or thoughts. Noah correctly predicted rain (the peg) but he didn't just sit around lamenting it, but he built constructively toward a good end. Be a builder.

Noah's Law of Business:

You get remembered for building the Ark - not for predicting the rain!

Sara.

- A rumor goes in one ear and out many mouths.

- "I discovered that I scream the same way, whether I'm about to be devoured by a great white shark, or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot."
Axl Rose

- Yesterday is a cancelled check, Tomorrow is a promisory note, Today is the only cash you have...so spend it wisely. ~Unknown

-- July 11, 2005 4:36 PM ∞

---

letsdodinar wrote:

Just for the record, I have purchased 2 million dinar from my local bank. This is NOT a rumor!

-- July 11, 2005 4:58 PM ∞

---

aaron wrote:

Georgewood. Can you post the link of the forum you read this on please. NOT GOOD. I should sell all 40MM of mine on on e-bay if this is the case.

-- July 11, 2005 7:34 PM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Sara,

Thanks for the encouraging words - the rumor did not dissuade me. Bought 4 million more this morning. & the Axl Rose quote - sweet!

Aaron - here you go. If u want to unload some let me know. Think you will have to cut and paste address into your browser.

www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?t=6749

-- July 12, 2005 7:14 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

How come the Western Media will immediately report on any terrorist acts, but we never see these kinds of articles making the top headlines over here?
Sara.
---
Iraqis accidentally blow themselves up fixing car bomb
(AFP)
7 July 2005

BAGHDAD - Two Iraqis accidentally blew themselves up overnight Wednesday to Thursday while preparing a car bomb in a home garage in Iraq’s northern city of Kirkuk, police said.

“One man was killed and another, who was injured, tried to escape but was arrested,” police colonel Anwar Abdallah told AFP.

A child sleeping on the rooftop of a nearby house was injured in the blast, he added.

“The explosion occurred around 4 am in the al-Askari district as the rebels worked on booby-trapping a car which exploded,” Abdallah said.

Explosives and weapons were found in the house and the area in the eastern part of the town, some 250 kilometers (150 miles) north of Baghdad, was cordoned off by Iraqi police and US forces, he added.

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/July/focusoniraq_July38.xml§ion=focusoniraq&col=

-- July 12, 2005 10:35 AM ∞

---

Lila wrote:

Letsdodinar;

You wrote:
Just for the record, I have purchased 2 million dinar from my local bank. This is NOT a rumor!

Comment by letsdodinar at July 11, 2005 04:58 PM | Permalink

What Bank would that be. Do you live in Iraq or is this an American Bank? I've bought all I want, but I'm just curious.

-- July 12, 2005 10:46 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

I think this might affect the global economy, including the Dinar..
Today, July 11th, online I found a little backup on my theory I called "Connecting the Dots" about what the President chose to do post-911.
Posted here: http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000502.html#12037
I still think President Bush acted prudently. Inaction would have been worse than what we face now. The next 911 would have already happened by now in the US without the prudent moves he has made (including going to war in Iraq).
Sara.
---
Al-Qaida nukes already in U.S.
Terrorists, bombs smuggled across Mexico border by MS-13 gangsters
Posted: July 11, 2005

WASHINGTON – As London recovers from the latest deadly al-Qaida attack that killed at least 50, top U.S. government officials are contemplating what they consider to be an inevitable and much bigger assault on America – one likely to kill millions, destroy the economy and fundamentally alter the course of history, reports Joseph Farah's G2 Bulletin.

According to captured al-Qaida leaders and documents, the plan is called the "American Hiroshima" and involves the multiple detonation of nuclear weapons already smuggled into the U.S. over the Mexican border with the help of the MS-13 street gang and other organized crime groups.

Al-Qaida has obtained at least 40 nuclear weapons from the former Soviet Union – including suitcase nukes, nuclear mines, artillery shells and even some missile warheads. In addition, documents captured in Afghanistan show al-Qaida had plans to assemble its own nuclear weapons with fissile material it purchased on the black market.

In addition to detonating its own nuclear weapons already planted in the U.S., military sources also say there is evidence to suggest al-Qaida is paying former Russian special forces Spetznaz to assist the terrorist group in locating nuclear weapons formerly concealed inside the U.S. by the Soviet Union during the Cold War. Osama bin Laden's group is also paying nuclear scientists from Russia and Pakistan to maintain its existing nuclear arsenal and assemble additional weapons with the materials it has invested hundreds of millions in procuring over a period of 10 years.

The plans for the devastating nuclear attack on the U.S. have been under development for more than a decade. It is designed as a final deadly blow of defeat to the U.S., which is seen by al-Qaida and its allies as "the Great Satan."

At least half the nuclear weapons in the al-Qaida arsenal were obtained for cash from the Chechen terrorist allies.

But the most disturbing news is that high level U.S. officials now believe at least some of those weapons have been smuggled into the U.S. for use in the near future in major cities as part of this "American Hiroshima" plan, according to an upcoming book, "The al-Qaida Connection: International Terrorism, Organized Crime and the Coming Apocalypse," by Paul L. Williams, a former FBI consultant.

According to Williams, former CIA Director George Tenet informed President Bush one month after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks that at least two suitcase nukes had reached al-Qaida operatives in the U.S.

"Each suitcase weighed between 50 and 80 kilograms (approximately 110 to 176 pounds) and contained enough fissionable plutonium and uranium to produce an explosive yield in excess of two kilotons," wrote Williams. "One suitcase bore the serial number 9999 and the Russian manufacturing date of 1988. The design of the weapons, Tenet told the president, is simple. The plutonium and uranium are kept in separate compartments that are linked to a triggering mechanism that can be activated by a clock or a call from the cell phone."

According to the author, the news sent Bush "through the roof," prompting him to order his national security team to give nuclear terrorism priority over every other threat to America.

However, it is worth noting that Bush failed to translate this policy into securing the U.S.-Mexico border through which the nuclear weapons and al-Qaida operatives are believed to have passed with the help of the MS-13 smugglers. He did, however, order the building of underground bunkers away from major metropolitan areas for use by federal government managers following an attack.

Bin Laden's goal, according to the book, is to kill at least 4 million Americans, 2 million of whom must be children. Only then, bin Laden has said, would the crimes committed by America on the Arab and Muslim world be avenged.

There is virtually no doubt among intelligence analysts al-Qaida has obtained fully assembled nuclear weapons, according to Williams. The only question is how many. Estimates range between a dozen and 70. The breathtaking news is that an undetermined number of these weapons, including suitcase bombs, mines and crude tactical nuclear weapons, have already been smuggled into the U.S. – at least some across the U.S.-Mexico border.

The future plan, according to captured al-Qaida agents and documents, suggests the attacks will take place simultaneously in major cities throughout the country – including New York, Boston, Washington, Las Vegas, Miami, Chicago and Los Angeles.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45203

-- July 12, 2005 11:14 AM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Sara,

Always believed that they are going to try and nuke NY but if they have that many weapons. God help us all.

-- July 12, 2005 11:57 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

The Deterrent...
Do you want to know why the Terrorist Jihadists won't attack the US as long as President Bush is leading the country?

Well, you see, the people of the US didn't pick a wimp like Kerry, but a man with principle and backbone.. a true Commander in Chief. He is prudent and acting in the best interests of the US, and he is no push over. And, although I am sure President Bush has not actually SAID SO publicly, (but he has never countered categorically the idea) the radical Jihadists have been made to understand that there would be retaliation, and strong retaliation, against them. They won't attack as long as he is President because President Bush has shown himself to be capable of this (below), and they would be fools to discount the possibility of his acting this way in the wake of the deaths of millions of Americans. This is one very strong reason why I believe they will not attack as long as he is President.
Sara.
----
From an opinion column:

Special delivery

I have to disagree with your [Joseph Farah's] assessment on the use of weapons of mass destruction. We should use our nuclear might as a deterrent but I think we need to be very specific as to what city will be incinerated: Mecca. Islam has an address.

It is a religion that relies on 'holy places' and sacred relics. Islam, unlike Christianity, is not written in the heart – it is written on the products of this Earth, good works, tasks, rules, places and the obvious place to hit and eliminate is Mecca. Make it a dirty bomb and announce that it will be a ground burst. Let it be known that a cockroach won't be able to live within a mile of the city for 1,000 years.

By threatening Mecca, you threaten one of the major pillars of Islam. Assuming the threat is carried out, you would have entire generations of Muslims who never make the required pilgrimage as called for in the Koran.

In order to defeat an enemy (or at least be left alone), you need to threaten what he cares about –so what does a fanatical Muslim care about?

His home? The Muftis and various leaders they live under keep them in squalor and filth with their corruption and decadence.

His wife? Maybe if he paused from beating her for a minute but it's not likely.

His children? He's too busy strapping bombs to them and sending them into day-care centers to blow themselves up.

The only thing a fanatical Muslim cares about is his religion, so it is there that we must strike.

Individual terrorists who are captured for lesser crimes (no weapons of mass destruction)? Execution by means of drowning in pigs' blood might bring on the appropriate amount of fear. As I understand it, Muslims are deathly afraid of dying in an unclean state and there are multiple ways to accomplish that. They do fear hell, at least, and since they believe it's works and rituals that get you there or out of there, that is the tact we must pursue. Only by doing these things will we have any chance of being left alone.

Brutal? Yes. Barbaric? Yep. Would it work? Probably.

- Craig J. Martin

Historical precedent

If we have a response planned and keep it a secret, it is reminiscent of the movie "Dr. Strangelove." What good is an overwhelming response if we don't let the enemy know the consequences of their actions?

I for one am for the destruction of Mecca and Medina if the radicals pop a nuke in the United States. MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) worked in the Cold War – why not this war?

- Dave Jaycox

Nuke Mecca, Medina

The deterrent is simple: Two high yield atomic bombs – one on Medina and one on Mecca. This would be the beginning of the end of Islam's evil jihad and finally stop over 1,300 years of unjustified attacks against Christianity and the West.

- Tom Graves

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/letters.asp

-- July 12, 2005 1:24 PM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

US and Iraqi officials sign economic, aid and development agreements:

AMMAN — After meeting for two days, US and Iraqi officials signed several agreements on Sunday to revive economic relations, facilitate assistance and pave way for the construction of Iraq.
"We had excellent meetings. We discussed a wide spectrum of issues dealing with many sectors and reached good conclusions on all issues raised," said Iraqi Finance Minister Ali Allawi, who co-chaired the meetings along with US Undersecretary of State Robert Zoellick.

Key topics tackled at the meetings "included macroeconomic and structural reform, Iraq's national development strategy, the energy sector, the agricultural sector, private sector development and job creation, and trade issues including WTO accession and US trade assistance policy," stated the joint communiquب of the meetings.

At a Monday press conference, Zoellick said US government representatives met with Iraqi businessmen who provided an insight "on what Iraq needs."

Several agreements were signed as a result of the two-day discussions, which took place here.

Regarding a promised $18.4 billion assistance to Iraq, officials from both sides signed a "bilateral assistance agreement" that "establishes the legal framework for a long-term US development assistance partnership with Iraq."

According to the USAID, the agreement outlines the terms and conditions to be applied to economic, technical and humanitarian aid to Iraq, and establishes a special US mission which will coordinate US economic assistance to Iraq.

Allawi said that these funds will contribute greatly to constructing Iraq. However, "the feasibility of projects now is lessened by the security situation, so the effect of assistance and construction projects will only show in the long-term," he added.

Another agreement related to public sector development and job creation was signed to provide risk insurance and loan guarantee financing programmes available to private US investors wishing to invest in Iraq.

The agreement also envisages the establishment of a USAID-funded "Investment Promotion Agency," to attract both Iraqi and foreign investors to open businesses in Iraq.

A 1987 commercial, economic and technical cooperation agreement was also revived between both countries "to promote private business opportunities by establishing trade offices and information exchanges between industry groups in both countries."

On the trade and investment front, a "US-Iraq trade and investment framework agreement" was signed. The agreement establishes a joint US-Iraq council to expand trade and investment ties.

In this context, the Iraqi minister of trade announced that his country has submitted a "Foreign Trade Memorandum" to the World Trade Organisation, as a first step to integrate the former socialist country into the global economy.

Meetings between the Iraqi oil and electricity ministries and the US departments of energy and state, "covered issues such as Iraq's natural gas utilisation for power generation."

Zoellick said that after security prevails, electricity is Iraq's major problem.

"Before the first Gulf War, natural gas was a source for electricity in Iraq... now Iraq imports electricity," he indicated, noting that both countries look at the topic of energy as an investment in future generations.

The US Trade and Development Agency (USTDA) and the Iraqi oil ministry signed an agreement by which the first party will sponsor a training programme for the ministry's staff.

USTDA regional director for the Middle East, North Africa and South Asia, Carl Kress, told The Jordan Times the US committed itself to develop human resources working in the Iraqi oil sector.

"We have been working to develop training plans with senior ministry staff along with US government agencies and private sector by establishing programmes that raise training level of Iraqi workforce working in the oil sector in the fields of basic management, technologies and drilling and human resource development," he said.

Kress pointed out that the end goal of the training is to provide Iraqis with exposure to modern technologies and to develop their relation with US professional associations and companies.

But "we signed no oil agreements and made no concessions for the time being," Allawi told The Jordan Times.

Iraq's second largest export, dates, had a share of the meetings and agreements.

"The Iraqi side welcomed President Bush's June 29 announcement expanding duty-free trade benefits in the US under the generalised preferences to include dates... the two sides discussed measures to further develop Iraq's dates industry through USAID's $100 million agricultural assistance programme, as well as steps to ensure Iraqi dates exports meet US sanitary and phyto-sanitary requirements," stated the communique.

Moreover, a memorandum of understanding was signed as a response to an Iraqi request for technical assistance and capacity building in the agricultural sector.

"Twenty-five per cent of the Iraqi population is involved in the agricultural sector. We need to focus on it for job creation, exports and food security," Zoellick said in the press conference.

Both sides also agreed to meet again next autumn to "coordinate and intesify efforts to revive Iraq's economy and reintegrate Iraq into the world economy."

However, both sides will meet by the Dead Sea on July 18 and 19 during the scheduled International Reconstruction Fund Facility for Iraq donor conference.

"The relations between the US and Iraqi governments have strengthened after liberation as the US deals with us on the basis that we have full sovereignty," Allawi told the press.

"We balance between now and the future: These meetings are important because they create hope and stability for the Iraqi people," Zoellick said.

He concluded the press conference by saying that the US learned from its history with insurgency that military action cannot stop insurgency and that if Iraq is to overcome this problem, it must focus on three pillars: Political independence, economic stability and building its own military.

-- July 12, 2005 1:29 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

One last comment on the Deterrent...

In that last post on a Deterrent I quoted a gentleman who said:
"By threatening Mecca, you threaten one of the major pillars of Islam. Assuming the threat is carried out, you would have entire generations of Muslims who never make the required pilgrimage as called for in the Koran."

For those of you who do not know, in order to be "saved" in Islam, an adherent to that religion must make a pilgrimmage to Mecca once in their lifetime. Failure to do so means that the person will forfeit their eternal soul (go to hell).

Making that pilgrimmage to Mecca impossible through nuclear decimation would likely cause many Islamics to turn away from their faith to other religions to be saved, since they would dispair of being able to get to haven through that religion. It could overthrow their entire religion.

I do think that would count for Jihadist Terrorists whose goal is to take over the globe for their religion, wouldn't you think?

Sara.

-- July 12, 2005 1:55 PM ∞

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MIchael wrote:

The signing of the free trade agreement is a HUGE deal in getting the DINAR to where we want it to be. In my opinion things are looking pretty dang good all over. As far as the bombs and stuff?? I would hope that the planet can get away from hate. I am not saying who is right and who is wrong. I am sure that each has a theory. I just believe that it starts with each of us, from there hopefully it will spread. God Bless!

-- July 12, 2005 2:35 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Ziarian;

Interesting article, no date or url on it, though. Could you post the date of the article and its url, please? Thanks!

Sara.

-- July 12, 2005 2:46 PM ∞

---

Terrance wrote:

Michael - you said "I am not saying who's right and who's wrong"?

If that's the case then nobody has any right or just cause to fight terrorism. If your not sure it's wrong, then you have no moral basis to combat it. Here is what I say - it is wrong. It is evil, and full of hate. We Americans don't hate the Islamic people, but we do hate the murder of innocent lives, oppression of women, and the torture of people who desire freedom.

It is a fact that the engine most responsible for acts of hate in the world today is the expansionist mandate of Islam. It is an expansionist doctrine embedded within the text of the Koran. From day one Mohammed spread Islam by the sword and nothing has changed since.

So I will not suspend reason in an attempt to not appear intolerant of other religions. Let me be clear - I am intolerant - I am intolerant of the murder of innocent Americans who had families they left behind on 9/11. I am intolerant of woman being raped and executed in the middle east for attempting to learn to read. I am intolerant of the brutal butchery of 52 Londoner's as they went about their daily lives of providing for their loved ones.

I need not tolerate any of this and worse yet - if I do then some day worse horrors than these will expose themselves to our loved ones.

You don't know who's right and who's wrong? Then either get some backbone and figure it out or sell your Dinar brother - because to invest in the dinar is to believe that freedom will triumph over oppression. It is all about right and wrong and good vs. evil.

I also will make a judgment about something good.....it will be very good to be sitting at the beach listening to the waves and watching a sunset in Hawaii with the smell of the slow roasting pig wafting through the air with Ron, Chromey, Carl 1 & 2 and the rest of you guys and gals....

Aloha - surf's up

T-

-- July 12, 2005 7:11 PM ∞

---

Sporter wrote:

U.S, Iraq sign pact to boost trade, investment ties

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States and the U.S.-backed government in Iraq have signed a formal agreement aimed at boosting economic ties between the two countries, the U.S. Trade Representative's office said on Monday.

ADVERTISEMENT

The pact, which could lead to a free trade agreement between Washington and Baghdad, was signed during a meeting of the U.S.-Iraq Joint Commission on Reconstruction and Economic Development in Amman, Jordan.

The trade and investment framework agreement, or TIFA, establishes a joint council to work on a wide range of commercial issues, USTR said.

"Iraq is making a major effort to reintegrate into the international economy and the meetings of the joint council should assist Iraq in this important endeavor," Assistant U.S. Trade Representative Ashley Wills said in a statement.

The United States and members of the United Nations had economic sanctions on Iraq for more than a decade prior to the U.S.-led invasion in March 2003 that toppled the regime of former President Saddam Hussein.

U.S. exports to Iraq surpassed $856 million in 2004, in the first full year after sanctions were lifted. Major items were goods to help rebuild the country such as generators, telecommunications equipment and trucks.

Spare parts for the U.S. military were another leading export, as well as consumer and household products such as cars, clothing, TVs, toys and sporting goods.

The United States imported $8.5 billion worth of mostly oil from Iraq last year. The Mideast country was a major market for U.S. agricultural goods before the first Gulf War in 1991.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20050711/us_nm/trade_iraq_usa_dc

-- July 12, 2005 7:52 PM ∞

---

newbie wrote:

Can you tell me the safest plast to buy Dinar?

-- July 12, 2005 8:02 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

GEORGEWOOD, glad you were not dissuaded from buying, and yes, I chuckled at the Axl Rose one myself. :)
I agree.. ONE nuke is too many in the hands of a terrorist.. God help us all.
I think that the deterrent I mentioned really COULD be used to great effect to stop them using the arsenal they have against us, however.

Sporter - Great post.. thanks! :)

Ziarian - I liked this quote from your post: "... both sides will meet by the Dead Sea on July 18 and 19 during the scheduled International Reconstruction Fund Facility for Iraq donor conference." Should be some interesting things come out of that! :)

Newbie;

Aaron used www.getiraqidinar.com and liked them and highly recommends them,
and millionaire2B was also happy with GID here:
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12404
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12416

Jimmy P was happy with www.myfreedinar.com/iraq here:
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12462

GEORGEWOOD and lookout said NO, NO.. NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOT to buy dinar from DINARMERCHANT.COM ... here:
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12957
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12328

Hope that helps.

Sara.

-- July 12, 2005 9:15 PM ∞

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newbie wrote:

Thank you Sara. I really appreciate the information.

-- July 12, 2005 10:58 PM ∞

---

RON wrote:

Hi all,sure alot of posts todayand some of it is great news.Terrance i am with out a dought with you.That will be a wonderful day for the NID gang.Good luck to all.RON

-- July 12, 2005 11:23 PM ∞

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Leo32 wrote:

"It is a fact that the engine most responsible for acts of hate in the world today is the expansionist mandate of Islam. It is an expansionist doctrine embedded within the text of the Koran. From day one Mohammed spread Islam by the sword and nothing has changed since."

You are such a stupid zionist, in the US and other European countries, Islam has spread by sword? Go and interview new converts, you hateful tiny-brained-idiot

-- July 13, 2005 5:51 AM ∞

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Lila wrote:

Leo32,

I think you might have just proved Terrance's point.

Lila

-- July 13, 2005 10:10 AM ∞

---

Lila wrote:

Has anyone got any thoughts on Lance's recent post on Iraq investors? Donald Trump and Citi Bank CEO has reportedly bought alot of Dinar. He says we should be watching for something to be announced as early as the 28th of July.

Lila

-- July 13, 2005 10:46 AM ∞

---

GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Did anyone else hear the rumor the US Government is producing a form for exchanging NID?

-- July 13, 2005 11:22 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Leo32:
This kind of news does nothing to endear the religious beliefs of these people to any compassionate soul.
Sara.
----
Bomber Kills Dozens in Iraq, Including GI, Kids
Wednesday, July 13, 2005

BAGHDAD, Iraq — A car bomber sped up to American soldiers distributing candy to children and detonated his explosives Wednesday, killing up to 27 other people, U.S. and Iraqi officials said. One U.S. soldier and about a dozen children were among the dead.

At least 21 others, including three U.S. soldiers, were wounded in the attack.

The fireball from Wednesday's blast also set a nearby house ablaze, the U.S. military said. The attack stunned the impoverished east Baghdad neighborhood of mostly Shiite Muslims and Christians.

At Kindi hospital, where many of the dead and injured were taken, one distraught woman swathed in black sat cross-legged outside the operating room. "May God curse the mujahedeen and their leader," she cried as she pounded her own head in grief.

Hospitals and police said between 11 and 13 children were killed. Authorities scrambled to compile a count of the dead and injured.

"The explosion was mainly on the children," resident Abbas Ali Jassim said.

Separately, coalition forces in Baghdad have captured Abu Musab al-Zarqawi's top lieutenant in Baghdad, Abu Abd al-Aziz, Gen. Richard Myers, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said Tuesday on "The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,162356,00.html

-- July 13, 2005 11:52 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Leo32;
Your saying that Islam has spread peacefully and that, therefore, MOST Muslims are peaceful may be true, but how do you tell which ones? This report says the four men who carried out the attacks in Britain were Pakistani in ethnicity with completely clean records, born and raised in the UK. It also says one of them was, "a devout Muslim who would go to the mosque sometimes five times a day" and "went to Pakistan for two months earlier this year to study religion". How, exactly, can we tell an extremist from what you say are "peaceful" Muslims who spread their religion by peaceful means? And once a person is a peaceful Muslim, what guarantees us they will remain so and not take up extremist ideology?
Sara.
----
Police hunt possible master bomber
Wednesday, July 13, 2005

LONDON, England (CNN) -- British Prime Minister Tony Blair said Wednesday he was "shocked" to learn that the bombing suspects were home-grown terrorists born and raised in the UK.

The four men, believed to be aged between 19 and 30 and of ethnic PAKISTANI origin, were captured on closed-circuit television at King's Cross Thameslink rail station shortly before the series of deadly bombings rocked London last Thursday morning.

Police have confirmed the identity of one of the four suspects as Shahzad Tanweer from Leeds, a 22-year-old sports science graduate who occasionally helped out in his father's fast food shop. He is the man who died in the Aldgate tube blast, PA reported.

A neighbor of Tanweer told the British television network ITN that Tanweer had told him he had traveled to Afghanistan and Pakistan, spending a couple of months in Afghanistan and four months in Lahore, Pakistan.

CNN's Vause said neighbors described Tanweer as a quiet young man, a devout Muslim who would go to the mosque sometimes five times a day but who also loved cricket and was an avid sports fan.

His uncle Bashir Ahmed told CNN: "He had everything to live for. He had no financial difficulties. I can't see how he can have done this."

Ahmed said his nephew went to Pakistan for two months earlier this year to study religion. But he denied that his nephew travelled to Afghanistan and took part in training camps.

"There is no way, I have seen his passport," he told PA. "He was proud to be British."

The home addresses of three of the men were among the locations searched in Tuesday's raids in West Yorkshire.

Vause said one of the houses being searched in Leeds belonged to 19-year-old suspect Hasib Hussain.

The police found personal documents bearing the names of three of the four men near the train seats where the bombs exploded, Clarke said.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/07/13/london.attacks/index.html

-- July 13, 2005 12:32 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Leo32;
It is a natural response to terrorism to be concerned about Islam, since terrorism does spring from that religious fold. Here, the Washington Times quotes a UK poll saying, "46 percent think that Islam poses a threat to Western liberal democracy".
Sara.
----
Britons favor tracking Muslim activities
THE WASHINGTON TIMES
July 13, 2005

Famously tolerant Britons overwhelmingly support tough new measures to monitor Muslim immigration and activities inside the country in the wake of last week's terrorist bombings in London, polls show.

That mood is likely to give new impetus to legislation being considered that would make it harder for foreign imams to come to Britain and preach religious hatred from its mosques.

Even before yesterday's developments, 82 percent of Britons were convinced that the London attacks were carried out by Islamic extremists, according to a YouGov poll published during the weekend in the London Telegraph.

Although respondents overwhelmingly thought the vast majority of Muslims in Britain are law-abiding, the poll found that 60 percent thought security services "should now focus their intelligence-gathering and terrorism-prevention efforts on Muslims in [Britain] or seeking to enter it."

The findings corresponded with the results of a Populus poll for the London Times, which found that more than 85 percent favor tighter controls on persons entering the country and new police powers to arrest those suspected of planning terrorist attacks.

The YouGov poll also found that 46 percent think that Islam poses a threat to Western liberal democracy.

Even before the Thursday attacks, many Britons were concerned about the flow into the country of extremist clerics who have taken advantage of Western freedoms to preach hatred and recruit young Muslims to violent causes, earning the capital the moniker "Londonistan."

http://www.washtimes.com/world/20050712-094358-2788r.htm

-- July 13, 2005 1:17 PM ∞

---

Lila Mcracken wrote:

Georgewood,

It's something from Lance on Investor's Iraq Forum. My daughter sent me a form. But then she said it's not anything we need because they will fill it out at the place where we cash it in. Does anyone who does this for a living have any information on this?

Lila

-- July 13, 2005 1:32 PM ∞

---

Lila Mcracken wrote:

Oops,

I guess I wasn't supposed to tell anybody where that last post came from. My mistake. (Man, this fun!)

Lila

-- July 13, 2005 1:36 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Lila;

Interesting posts of Lance's. I am looking forward to what will happen between now and the end of this month, too. :)

GEORGEWOOD;

What is the exact nature of the new government form for exchanging NID, do you know? Is it a tax form - (Uncle Sam taking his cut off the top)? Does it have to do with tracking those who exchange Dinars - (looking for terrorists, money laundering by the terrorists from Iraq - homeland security issue)? Or what? Do you know? A url would be helpful..

Sara.

-- July 13, 2005 1:53 PM ∞

---

Michael wrote:

Terrance I can assure you that my "backBone" is as strong as an oak. I said that specifically so as not to get in a discussion such as this one. I am a Christian in IRAQ for the last 18 months. I am also a vereran of our Armed Forces. Thanks for your concern as to my Dinar investment. It is not needed as I am well aware as to what is at stake. I have an extremely strong moral code to which I feel no need nor desire to defend to you, although I can appreciate your points. I just didn't feel the need to debate it here in this forum. I am in for the long haul I can assure you. Good luck and God Bless!

-- July 13, 2005 3:05 PM ∞

---

Aaron wrote:

Lila you posted the following about Lances statement. I did not see the post from Lance. Lila or Lance can you expound on the following. Also can you give some links and posts that would make you think something of the 28th of July. Getting excited. Also the information has been great of late. No arguing, and good info. I LIKE IT!!!

Thank you
Comment by Lila at July 13, 2005 10:10 AM | Permalink
Has anyone got any thoughts on Lance's recent post on Iraq investors? Donald Trump and Citi Bank CEO has reportedly bought alot of Dinar. He says we should be watching for something to be announced as early as the 28th of July.

-- July 13, 2005 3:16 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

These measures being taken are not without foundation.
----
Police sweep Islamic areas in Italy
2005-07-13
By Denis Barnett - ROME

Hundreds of police swept into Islamic communities across Italy on Wednesday, raiding dozens of homes and seizing material in several cities a day after the government announced a series of measures aimed at cracking down on Islamic extremism.

Police and Carabinieri officers backed by Italy's special anti-terrorism unit, the DIGOS, searched homes and buildings in Turin, Florence, Bologna, Rome, Naples and other cities from early morning. Hundreds of people underwent identity checks, and documents and computer equipment were seized for analysis.

Searches also took place in North African communities in Siracusa and Ragusa on Sicily's east coast.

Surveillance is also expected to be stepped up around mosques. A mosque in Milan was described by the US state department as a "breeding ground" for Islamic radicalism in the wake of the September 11 attacks on the United States.

It follows a similar but smaller operation in the immediate aftermath of the London attacks in which 142 people, mostly illegal immigrants, were arrested, and dozens later deported.

Rome mayor Walter Veltroni said he shared the interior minister's concern over the threat of terrorism.

"I have said before, after the attacks in New York and Madrid, that nobody should underestimate the threat faced by all European countries," Veltroni said.

http://www.middle(dash)east(dash)online.com/english/?id=14000

-- July 13, 2005 3:38 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Note the consequences of quitting Iraq in this article include, "newly confident terrorists would strike our homeland again".
Can we afford not to win this one?
Sara.
---
What's the value of victory?
By Ralph Peters
USA Today
07/12/2005

In classical economics, an item's value is determined by the price someone will pay for it. By that measure, Iraq is the world's most valuable real estate to Islamist terrorists.

Critics claimed that Iraq was a diversion from the war on terror. Yet the terrorists are committing all the lives they can muster and every resource they command to prevent the emergence of a rule-of-law democracy in Baghdad. Even the recent bombings in London seemed to be intended to drive British forces out of Iraq.

If Iraq doesn't matter, why are Islamist terrorists so desperate to dislodge us?

When defeatists insist that Iraq has cost us too dearly and we need to set a timetable for withdrawal, consider the price our foes have been willing to pay: Tens of thousands of terrorists and their allies have died or been captured. The situation looks far bleaker from our enemy's vantage point.

If Iraq's various ethnic and religious communities build a reasonably equitable democracy that broadly respects human rights, it will be the greatest success Arabs (and Kurds) have seen in 700 years. And Arabs need a win. Behind all their protests and posturing, they're afraid that they can't build a decent, modern state where elections count and a constitution prevails. Even an imperfect result in Baghdad would give the Arab world a level of moral refreshment that no authoritarian regime could ever deliver.

The terrorists understand that. The fanatics who believe in a bloodthirsty, disciplinarian God realize that a popular, tolerant state in the Middle East would kill their dream of winning over the masses. Corrupt, oppressive governments plowed the soil for the extremists. Saudi and Gulf-Arab funding provided the fertilizer. The seeds of hatred grew wildly as we looked away. Now, the terrorists want to harvest the crop.

Terrorists know how much is at stake and they're united behind their cause. Meanwhile, we've become a house divided, allowing the debate over Iraq to be hijacked by ideologues on both the right and left.

Today, some left-wing opinion-makers appear to be rooting for Iraq to fail. Every call for a timetable for the withdrawal of our troops is a gift to the terrorists. Speeches on Capitol Hill insisting that Americans are tired of the war, that our casualties are too high and that we need an “exit strategy” provide aid and comfort to media-savvy enemies. Scoring political points in wartime kills American soldiers.

The let's-embarrass-Bush voices must consider the consequences of partisanship. If we promise that our troops will leave by a given date, we have effectively surrendered. The fanatics have only to wait until we leave. The subsequent bloodbath would be stunning — and could lead to a regional war.

As for disingenuous calls to “support our troops, bring them home,” they always seem to come from those who never served in uniform themselves. I spend a great deal of time with our soldiers. They believe in their cause. Recruiting may be tougher in wartime, but our combat troops are re-enlisting at higher rates than in peacetime.

Yes, this war damaged our military. That's what war does. But far from “breaking” our armed forces, our commitments have given us the world's most experienced military.

If those on the right have lied about the administration's frequent incompetence, those on the left need to weigh the price we would pay for quitting Iraq. The terrorists would have won the strategic Super Bowl. Progress in the Middle East would collapse. Fanaticism would spread as never before. And newly confident terrorists would strike our homeland again.

The situation in Iraq is far from ideal. But it isn't remotely as bad as the relentlessly negative media reports imply. Good news isn't news. So we're bombarded with breathless reporting about casualties and car bombings or the murder of the Egyptian ambassador, but we get no sense of the far more complex reality. This struggle is so difficult because our enemies view it as decisive. They'll pay any price to win.

We need to get beyond our partisan quarrels. The terrorists lack the power to defeat us. But we certainly have the power to defeat ourselves. The greatest danger is talking ourselves into failure.
http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050713/oplede13.art.htm

-- July 13, 2005 4:09 PM ∞

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Lila Mcracken wrote:

This site has forms #104 and #105 which deal with currency transactions:

http://www.fincen.gov/reg_bsaforms.html#105

I don't, but it seems like these might be filled out by the institution that cashes in our dinar. So maybe they aren't too important right now?

-- July 13, 2005 5:44 PM ∞

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newbie wrote:

I am new. Could someone please explain the difference in Dinar? The $10,000 ones I got were on paper, the counterfeit pens did not work on them. But the $25,000 ones I got were printed on linen and the pens do work on them. Also the $10,000 ones had the black security thread while the $25,000 ones had the gold thread.

Are Dinar currencies printed on different paper? Or could my $25,000 ones be old dinar?

Thanks

-- July 13, 2005 9:35 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Lila;

The url that you posted concerning forms #104 and #105 which deal with currency transactions are regular forms that have existed for a long time. I thought GEORGEWOOD was speaking of a NEW form when he said:

"Did anyone else hear the rumor the US Government is producing a form for exchanging NID?"
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#13049

A form specifically for exchanging NID.. is what he said. If there is any substance to the rumor, GEORGEWOOD or Lila, please post it. It would be interesting. :)

Sara.

-- July 13, 2005 9:45 PM ∞

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Lila Mcracken wrote:

Sara and Aaron,

The post by Lance is on: http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?t=6213

Investor's Iraq Forum.

Lance is someone with alot of information but it's not clear where his information is from and while most enjoy reading his posts, his legitamacy is questionable.

As for the forms, he mentioned a new form that our government is supposed to be putting out soon and it would be best if you read it yourselves. My daughter searched for the forms and that was the site with the current forms.

I remember quite awhile back that someone had been discussing Lance's comments here on T&B so I assumed that the people on this blog were also monitoring the other site as well. I shouldn't have made that assumption. Sorry for the confusion.

Lance seems to think that the dinar will go up on the 28th of this month. I hope he's right but I'm not going to buy my new Cadillac just yet.

Lila

-- July 13, 2005 10:32 PM ∞

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Lila Mcracken wrote:

Assistant U.S. Trade Representative Ashley Wills and Iraq's Minister of Finance, Dr. Ali Abdulameer Allawi, signed a Trade and Investment Framework Agreement (TIFA) today during a meeting of the U.S.-Iraq Joint Commission on Reconstruction and Economic Development.

Deputy Secretary of State Robert B. Zoellick, who chaired the U.S. delegation to the Commission meeting, attended the signing ceremony.

"I am delighted that we have reached agreement with Iraq on the TIFA. Iraq is making a major effort to reintegrate into the international economy, and the meetings of the Joint Council should assist Iraq in this important endeavor. We believe that the U.S.-Iraq TIFA will enhance trade between our two countries and assist Iraq as it seeks to grow and diversify its economy," Wills said at the signing.

The TIFA provides a forum for Iraq and the United States to examine ways to expand bilateral trade and investment. It creates a Joint Council that will consider a wide range of commercial issues and sets out basic principles underlying the two nation's trade and investment relationship.

The Council will establish a permanent dialogue with the expectation of expanding trade and investment between Iraq and the United States.

http://www.portaliraq.com/news/U.S.+signs+agreement+to+support+expansion+of+Iraqi+economy__1111309.html

-- July 13, 2005 11:00 PM ∞

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GEORGEWOOD wrote:

Sorry, the form is the same one that Lila has referred to which was brought up by Lance on another site.

Does anyone have any thoughts on Lance? I cant figure out if he has the best information on the planet or is just a bs artist. I am pretty new to this but would love to hear some veterans take on him - have any of his predictions come true to date?

-- July 14, 2005 6:57 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

What is this?

AMERICANS advocating attacks on places of worship? Innocent civilians getting killed? Do we have to perform the kind of acts perpetrated against our people to win?

NOT IN MY BOOK. I'm an AMERICAN soldier. We'll win this war by doing what we know is right.
My son told me once when he was little that he wanted to be a soldier, and asked me what we did. I responded that an AMERICAN soldier is a protector, and fights only when he has to....That AMERICAN soldiers come to HELP, not HURT.
Once again we have armchair QBs who believe that "might makes right".That kind of "Curtis LeMay thinking" has been proven wrong on numerous occasions since the '50s. Hey QB(Terrance), I have an idea, why dont you come over here and see the faces of the kids that would be orphaned, killed, or maimed,if your ignorant ravings were followed. How 'bout you coming over here and seeing the aid stations and OUR MEDICS who SAVE lives, both American and Iraqi, who get hurt by the same kind of thinking that you expound.
You have the audacity, sitting safe on your ass, to question the "Backbone" of someone here. I know some soldiers here who have more backbone that you and yours will ever know..........

Proud to be,

SGT at SPOD

-- July 14, 2005 7:30 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

Sorry Terance....My mistake, you are not the one mentioning Nuking Mecca.
But I dont appreciate nor condone the Backbone comment...

-- July 14, 2005 7:38 AM ∞

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Johnny Cash wrote:

Wednesday, July 13, 2005 Over 60 countries to discuss progress of Iraq reconstruction
(MENAFN) Representatives of more than 60 countries and international organizations, including the United Nations (UN) and the World Bank, will gather at the Dead Sea in Jordan on July 18 and 19 to review the progress of donor-financed reconstruction activities in Iraq, Poratal Iraq reported. Hosted by Jordan and chaired by the Government of Canada, the Fourth International Reconstruction Fund Facility for Iraq (IRFFI) Meeting will focus on achievements to date. At the meeting, the UN Assistance Mission for Iraq (UNAMI) states, the Government of Iraq will present its priorities and discuss with donors how best to coordinate efforts to move the reconstruction process forward. The first IRFFI meeting to convene since the January 2005 elections in Iraq, the Dead Sea gathering is expected by UNAMI to provide a new momentum to Iraq reconstruction efforts. International donors established IRFFI at the 2003 Madrid Conference to facilitate the provision of Iraq reconstruction assistance effectively. The IRFFI has two trust funds, separately administered by the World Bank and the UN in close coordination with the Iraqi authorities and donors. To date, international donors have committed a total of $1 billion to the two trust funds. http://www.tbiraq.com/menafn_news_bl.asp?inc_name=news_details&n_id=99867

-- July 14, 2005 8:53 AM ∞

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Johnny Cash wrote:

Thursday, July 14, 2005 APU writes off Iraq's debt
(MENAFN) Over $805,000 of Iraq's national debt owed to the Arab Inter-Parliamentary Union (APU) is to be cancelled, a federation committee resolution said, KUNA reported. The APU's economic committee, which made the decision, also called for scrapping the debts owed to it by Djibouti and Comoros Islands. Kuwait's delegate to the APU said that the decision to scrap Iraq's debt to APU was reached in appreciation of Iraq's current circumstances, specifically in view of its inability to repay its subscription fees to APU, which have accumulated year after year. He called on other Arab countries to do the same and scrap Iraq's debts and help the Iraqis in any way they could.

http://www.tbiraq.com/menafn_news_bl.asp?inc_name=news_details&n_id=100147

-- July 14, 2005 8:55 AM ∞

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james hghes wrote:

I would not recommend anyone deal with "midamericatrade"for iraq dinars.
I went through the ordering process but have not received anything yet.This was on the 16th june.
I have tried e-mailing them on numerous occasions but to no avail

-- July 14, 2005 11:52 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

SGT at SPOD;

You said:
"AMERICANS advocating attacks on places of worship? Innocent civilians getting killed? Do we have to perform the kind of acts perpetrated against our people to win?"

I agree, that is a barbaric solution, the very worst. However, do consider that the US did have MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) with the Russians during the Cold War, and it did work to keep the peace, didn't it? I would presume that if MILLIONS of Americans were killed in coordinated attacks against our cities, that you would.. twiddle your thumbs? Since those responsible would be dead, who would you retaliate against? Look at the London bombings.. who is brought to justice? Not those who did the deed.

Saying you will attack a PLACE (not people, not "innocent civilians getting killed", but yes, a Holy PLACE they consider to be a sacred place to them of worship), if it deters them from setting off nuclear bombs and killing millions of Americans, may be the only deterrent we have. If you have a better one you think the terrorists will listen to, please do share it. ANY peaceful solution would be preferrable, but in the absence of one, surely some consequence must be invoked they will listen to, as that gentleman Craig said, "In order to defeat an enemy (or at least be left alone), you need to threaten what he cares about".
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#13021

So, how do you prefer to make them leave us and our loved ones alone? I am sure your wisdom can be used to stop the attacks in Iraq, if you have one. This "nuke Mecca" solution is the worst of all solutions, I agree.. can you give a better deterrent? What would be the proper solution that the terrorists will listen to? Again, as Craig stated, the terrorists do not seem worried if you threaten their homes, their families, their children... he said, "The only thing a fanatical Muslim cares about is his religion, so it is there that we must strike."

If you remove from the US the ability to strike there, and say that is unsportsmanlike and ungentlemanly conduct.. how do you protect YOUR home, your wife and your children? Do you think the terrorists will likewise refrain from such ungentlemanly conduct toward what you care about? I agree with you that, "an AMERICAN soldier is a protector, and fights only when he has to....That AMERICAN soldiers come to HELP, not HURT" but MAD was a deterrent we once used with great effect in the Cold War. These thinkers I quoted merely said, let us make another deterrent which the terrorists WILL care about. Otherwise.. there is no deterrent, and YOUR son who told you he wanted to be an American soldier, along with countless others, could die. If the American soldier is to protect their homeland then the entire military complex must look at what it takes to win against a ruthless force which says, quote,

"Bin Laden's goal, according to the book, is to kill at least 4 million Americans, 2 million of whom must be children. Only then, bin Laden has said, would the crimes committed by America on the Arab and Muslim world be avenged."
http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#13005

Exactly HOW are you going to protect us from THAT considering that, quote (from the same article):

"There is virtually no doubt among intelligence analysts al-Qaida has obtained fully assembled nuclear weapons, according to Williams. The only question is how many. Estimates range between a dozen and 70. The breathtaking news is that an undetermined number of these weapons, including suitcase bombs, mines and crude tactical nuclear weapons, have already been smuggled into the U.S. – at least some across the U.S.-Mexico border."

How will you stop them using those weapons against us? By politely telling them you are a gentleman and only wish to protect the innocent?

As Craig said, "Brutal? Yes. Barbaric? Yep. Would it work? Probably." If you have something milder that would work instead, please do share it. It is the WORST and most barbaric solution, I agree, but to replace it you must have an alternative that works. Exactly what ELSE, what other solution do you advocate that the terrorists will listen to? Since the terrorists only understand force, what force will you use to make them behave.. more gentlemanly? (Like NOT killing "4 million Americans, 2 million of whom must be children".)

If the US ever elects as President any person who will swear that they will NOT nuke Mecca no matter what happens, that is the day I believe we will have nuclear attacks on our soil, killing the millions Bin Laden has called for, "2 million of whom must be children".

Sara.

-- July 14, 2005 12:10 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Iraqi Constitution Draft Submitted to Parliament
By Cihan News Agency
Published: Thursday July 14, 2005
zaman.com

The new Iraq constitution expected to be ready by August 15 has been submitted to the Parliament for examination and debate.

After the delegation in charge of preparing the text complete the document, it will be put to a public vote.

Speaker of Parliament Hussein Sharistani informed that they have three days to study the draft and after that it will be presented to a referendum.

http://www.zaman.com/?bl=hotnews&alt=&trh=20050712&hn=21674

-- July 14, 2005 2:14 PM ∞

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RYAN wrote:

check this link out iraq banks

http://www.almendhar.com/english_4488/news.aspx
Baghdad: The general manager of Al Rasheed bank said that citizens are now able to open accounts in foreign currency at any branch of the bank.

http://www.almendhar.com/english_4429/news.aspx

Cairo: "Orascom Telecom", the Egyptian Company, said that it intends to pump 2.5 billion dollars in Iraq, during the coming period. Nagib Sawires, company's chairman, has declared his personal intention to pump investments in various fields to participate in pushing the wheel of economic development in the country.

good signs

-- July 14, 2005 2:35 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?p=77492#post77492

Interesting post..

Sara.

-- July 14, 2005 4:36 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Hello Boys and girls . I'm an AMERICAN soldier.
I am in Iraq , I know, iknow , i know.

You all owe me.

How about that. Remind us of anyone

-- July 14, 2005 7:31 PM ∞

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meatgrinder wrote:

I think Lance is full of crap. Where do you get your info Lance? Lance seems to think that he knows something that we do not. What is happing on the 28th? Hey Lance how is your Dinar btokerage doing?

-- July 14, 2005 7:42 PM ∞

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allen wrote:

Sara posted:
http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?p=77492#post77492

Interesting post..

Sara.

excerpt from post above;

"Explicit talk of the dinar, except in the highest levels of the WH and Capitol Hill, has been restricted. WH reporters were told not to inquire publicly about the dinar.

While naysayers might interpret this as ominous, one thesis is that the "powers-that-be" would rather focus on completing the confluence of factors to justify the significant appreciation of the dinar than be distracted by academic discourse. And when it's released at the target, there will be "shock and awe."

Does that sound plausible? American reporters
being restricted from asking certain questions??
(dinar aside, any subject that was asked of reporters not to be brought up, would create more stir and contraversary, I would think,and would just add fuel to the fire)

allen

-- July 15, 2005 12:12 AM ∞

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Bobby Floyd wrote:

Sara:

Your comments to SGT at SPOD were beautiful. You said exactly what I was thinking but lacked the ability to put it into words. Until now, I thought you were somewhat of a Pacificist who sought a peaceful solution to everything.

In order to stop the terrorist, we must create some type of deterrent. So far the only deterrent is to bring them to justice which means to take them from their cave, hole, or dirty backroom and put them in a nice clean cell, provide their medical needs, and give them three good meals per day.

The only solution is to find the terrorist, kill them and wipe out this cancer in our civilization.
Also, Curtis Lemay was a great American Patriot and soldier who does not deserve to be demonized by anyone. \

SGT at SPOD, I have read everything you have written with admiration but your last post did not reflect the man that I thought you were.

-- July 15, 2005 12:58 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Suspected leaders of al Qaeda in Iraq captured
U.S.: One of men may be linked to Egyptian envoy's killing
Thursday, July 14, 2005

(CNN) -- U.S.-led coalition forces have captured two alleged leaders of the insurgent group al Qaeda in Iraq, including a man suspected in the death of an Egyptian envoy, an American military spokesman said Thursday.

Troops caught Khamis Farhan Khalaf abd al Fahdawi, also known as Abu Seba, on Saturday in Ramadi, west of Baghdad, after intelligence led them there.

Abu Seba reportedly is a senior lieutenant for` Jordanian-born militant Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and is suspected in this month's attacks on Bahraini and Pakistani diplomats and the killing of Ihab al-Sherif, who came to Iraq to be Egypt's ambassador.

In addition, forces detained Abdulla Ibrahim Muhammed Hassan al Shadad, also known as Abu Abdul Aziz, on Sunday in Baghdad. He reportedly is the leader of al-Zarqawi's operations in the Iraqi capital and a key officer for the insurgent group.

The U.S. spokesman said the arrests and recent raids yielded evidence and equipment implicating the men in al-Zarqawi's leadership cell.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/07/14/iraq.main/index.html

-- July 15, 2005 2:03 AM ∞

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Carl wrote:

WHICH GROUP ARE YOU IN, THAT POINTS A FINGER AT THE OTHER AND YELLS "FALSE RELIGION", "YOU ARE A OCCULT", AND LETS NUKEM ALL. AFTER ALL, THEY ARE JUST MUSLIM, OR FOR THE MUSLIM GROUP, "JUST CHRISTIANS". EVERYBODY KNOWS ALL MUSLIMS, OR ALL CHRISTIANS ARE EVIL AND WORSHIP A FALSE GOD AND EVEN WORST.
Its words and attitudes like this, that is the problem, not the solution. This attitude, makes those individuals just as evil, just as dangerous, and just as intolerate as the muslim extremist.
Put them in the same bag, pull one out and they all look the same.The talk of or threating to wipe out a entire group of people because of their race or because of their selection of faith is the same attitude that Marched 7000 men and young boys into a field on July 11, 1995 in SREBRENICA, Bosnia and Herzegovina. It is the same attitude, of their neighbors and ex-friends who stood in line with machine guns and shot them down in groups, and individually, while 100's of blue helmeted Dutch UN peacekeepers, who were suppose to protect the village, huddled in a clearing, shaking, cowering like field mice. These so called brave United Nations unit of crap(I refuse to call them soldiers), gave up their weapons, and stood by while the executions took place over and over and over, as the screams rang out through the day.
What were the 7000 men and young boys crime. Being Muslim.
Ask the United Nations about it now, and they will not talk.
I believe that day describes the United Nations and its value to mankind.
Like the Germans for years, the Serbs denied that it even happen. That it was all a fabrication. That is until their own TV stations started showing the videos that were taken that day, and the falling of bodies as the bullets tore flesh.
Its disturbing to me, to think that a friend of mine would even consider participating in such attrocities, or even think of killing another race or faith just to wipe them out.
Its this type of "Judge Roy Moore" thinking, the thats what god wants, and "BY GOD THAT IS THE WAY IT IS GOING TO BE" , that scares the hell of me.
Somewhere along the road, these type of people forgot we are fighting extremist, not muslims. Not all muslims want to kill christians or any other faith. Many times you hear, the koran quotes "kill the infidels or non-believers". That was written back centuries ago, when the muslims sects were fighting each other, in their own land. I believe the bible, says something like, if the eye offends thee, and causes you to lust after another woman, you are to pluck it out. Do ya know of any christian who has plucked out their eye lately?
Just because a verse is written doesn't mean it is carried out. That agrument is insane.
What does all of this have to do with Iraq or the dinar?
Every thing is related. The extremist are just that extremist. They are killing everybody, muslims, christians, and other faith equally. Have you heard of a sucide insurgent getting out of his car and asking everybody who is the blast area to leave if they are a muslim?
These type of people you can not negoiate with. They want to eliminate you,your race, and faith period. They just happen to be using the muslim faith as their flag banner. No different than the extreme christians during the crusades of the middle east centuries ago. To hold a whole race of people or faith hostage with a nuke threat because of small percentage of extremist is like holding the christian faith hostage with a nuke threat because of Judge Roy Moore sneaking the 10 commandments into the Alabama Supreme Court building in middle of the night, like a common thief.
I have always wondered, if Judge Moore thought he was so right, why did he move the commandments under the cover of darkness and not in the day time so everyone could observe?
What is the solution?
The Solution is simply remembering that we are all of the human race. The generation of today will have to die out, and as they do the old attitudes will die with them. Muslim, Christian, and children of other faiths must be brought together and allowed to play and grow up together. The young are the hope of the future. By changing their attitudes toward one another, this slowly eliminates the hatred of one another. I was born, raised and live in Alabama. I can tell you what extreme intolerance is about. As a young police officer, I stood in the riot lines, and I saw it first hand. When the South had forced busing, white children were shipped miles to black schools, and black children were shipped miles to white schools. This was sociol engineering at its extreme. Painful yes, demostrations yes, did it work? Yes...Was it for the best? Most certainly..
Today! I sat down with people of all color in any public building or private home and think nothing of it. I see my friends do the same thing. Did this happen over night? No! But, the social changes of acceptance did happen. It is for the better. Irag and all of the world will have to go through that social engineering in order to improve life. Will it happen? That depends on the leaders. It takes men who will stand against the tide of public opinions, and polls to move things as they should be, not as the status quo want it to be ...
Thank God, we in America had such men who stood and did what was right, not just popular. I can remember the time when it was greatly debated by some faiths what it was going to be like having a catholic as a president."JFK"
That is the solution to the extremist, not threating to nuke some race of people, location or faith.
SGT AT SPOD, I stand with you on this one bud..

-- July 15, 2005 9:14 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Bobby Floyd ;

You wrote:
"Until now, I thought you were somewhat of a Pacificist who sought a peaceful solution to everything."

I am somewhat of a Pacificist who seeks peaceful solutions to everything. I just am unable to see how a Pacificist solution can work in these circumstances. The terrorists will not listen to reason, and kill the innocent without cause. I think Carl would have it that the position I spoke of which I see as a deterrent and SELF DEFENSE is bloodthirsty, and that it is evil for us to even reluctantly allow that we must find a deterrent to try and save innocent American lives in light of very real threats to our nation.

The terrorists do not think there IS such a thing an "innocent American lives" to protect. We are all "guilty". And of what? Of the very thing Carl mentions.. of holding to our democracy, our way of life, and our religious beliefs peacefully. I must agree with him that when ANY religious group goes out killing people indiscriminately, that they are wrong. Let us apply this to the terrorists, since they are showing evidence of it every day and that is what we are seeking to prevent. No, Bobby, I cannot see a Pacifist solution working in this scenerio, since force is the only thing that terrorists listen to. They WILL NOT negotiate with us, nor come to the bargaining table. They are unequivocal in what they wish, and peace is not among their objectives.

Carl says to slowly work on changing the values of the extremists, but I do not see how practically that solution will work in the near term. The enemy we face TODAY may change in a few generations, true. But the threat of nuclear warfare and WMD on our soil is not remote possibilities. There are nukes presently in our country and people willing to use them today. Advocating a "wait and integrate with them, dialog with them, like we did with the races during the past in the US" is not going to work in this scenerio. I don't think the terrorists are going to peacefully live and work with Christians or Jews. And it does not appear to me that we have the luxury of time to wait until they all die off before we find a workable solution and deterrent to this dilemma.

When looking at the context of Jesus' words about plucking out an eye, he also spoke about a man who had a log in his eye and needed to take it out. Neither of these comments was meant, in context, to be literal, as a reading of the passage would show.

Mat 7:4-5 Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

It appears obvious that when the quote is speaking of a PLANK in a person's eye, it is not literal, but figurative. Same with cutting out an eye when it "offends" you by lusting. The idea is to deal ruthlessly with the sinfulness inside the person, not cut off body parts. After all, a person can still lust after someone with one eye as well as two. (See also Matt 15:16-20)

However, in the Koran, there are verses which specifically say, as Carl quoted, to "kill the infidels or non-believers". These are definitely meant to be taken literally, not figuratively. Judge what their own Koran speaks for yourself. Can they mean anything else? (What do the words slay, war and carnage mean?)

"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it." (Surah 2:216)

"Believers, do not make friends with any but your own people...They desire nothing but your ruin....(Surah 3:118, 119)

"Seek out your enemies relentlessly." (Surah 4:103-)

"Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends." (Surah 5:51)

"If you fear treachery from any of your allies, you may fairly retaliate by breaking off your treaty with them." (Surah 8:51-)

"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given [Jews and Christians]...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-)

"It is He who has sent forth His apostle with guidance and the true Faith [Islam] to make it triumphant over all religions, however much the idolaters [non-Muslims] may dislike it." (Surah 9:31-)

"If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)

"Muhammad is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful to one another." (Surah 48:29)

http://www.daveandangel.com/CRN/Exposing_the_Koran.shtml

Jesus' example when his disciples took up a sword and cut off the ear of one of those who came to take Him forceably was interesting as it shows us His view of fighting for our God (for Jesus is God to Christians). He healed the man's ear and told his disciples not to fight.

Luk 22:50 And one of them struck the servant of the high priest and cut off his right ear.

Luk 22:51 But Jesus answered and said, "Permit even this." And He touched his ear and healed him.

Joh 18:11 And Jesus said to Peter, "Put your sword into the sheath. Shall I not drink the cup which My Father has given Me?"

Then, when questioned by Pilate about it, this was Jesus' reply:

Joh 18:36 Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews; but now My kingdom is not from here."

These words and example are quite different from those of the Koran (above). A devout Christian, seeking to be like their leader, tends toward passifism; a devout Muslim, emulating their leader and following his words, toward war.

Carl offered as a solution:

"Muslim, Christian, and children of other faiths must be brought together and allowed to play and grow up together. The young are the hope of the future. By changing their attitudes toward one another, this slowly eliminates the hatred of one another."

These are good and noble goals. As he said.. it will SLOWLY eliminate hatred. But when faced with nuclear bombs already on our soil and those who just may wish to not wait until that tolerance has proven itself in history, I felt the deterrent solution was the only rational alternative for our self-preservation, even though I am a passifist.

You may ask how do I reconcile that with my passifist beliefs? Self-defence is allowed in the Bible. When Jesus was sending his people out to preach, He did allow them to arm themselves against robbers.

Luk 22:36 Then He said to them, "But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise his scrip; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one.

The sword spoken of here was for self-defence, not to kill people for not adhering to their religious views, as Jesus further instructed them concerning those who would not hear their words:

Mat 10:14 And whoever will not receive you nor hear your words, when you depart from that house or city, shake off the dust from your feet.

He did not say if they will not hear your words, use the sword and run them through.

In light of the threat posed by Islamic extremists, I feel this deterrent must be taken to protect us even as Jesus allowed His disciples to take a sword to protect themselves from maurading robbers on the road.

As for it unfairly targeting the NON-extremist Muslims, I hope you can recall Cecil B. DeMille's movie called "The Ten Commandments" starring Charlton Heston. They tried to make that movie as close to historical and as accurate as they could, using many sources. At one point in the movie, Pharoah's queen Nefertiri goes to the place where Moses' family are staying in Egypt's Goshen and finds Moses' wife and son. She makes them leave Egypt and when Moses arrives this dialog ensues...

N: "She's gone with your son to Midian."
M: "Why would she leave?"
N: "She knew you would try to save the other children before your own son."
M: "Save the other children -- from what?"
N: "Rameses is massing the Libyan axemen, the chariots, the Sardinian swordsman..."
M: "Why - tell me why!"
N: "To destroy the firstborn of Israel."
M: "Oh God, my GOD! - Out of his own mouth comes Thy Judgement."
N: "But I have saved your son, Moses."
M: "It is not my son who will die - it is - it is YOUR son, Nefertiri!"
N: "NO! - You would not DARE strike Pharoah's son!"
M: "In the hardness of his heart Pharoah has mocked God and brings death to his own son!"
N: "But he is MY son, Moses - you would not hurt my son!"
M: "By myself, I am nothing - it is the power of God which uses me to work His will."
N: "You would not let Him do this to me - I saved your son!"
M: "I cannot save yours."

God once worked this way in history. Though Moses did not wish Nefertiti's son to die, he was completely unable to stop the hand of God in history which had come because Pharoah mocked God and sought to kill His people. Out of Pharoah's own mouth came the very destruction of that which Pharoah held most dear. That which was precious (the lives of the Israelite children) Pharoah sought to destroy, and the curse he sought to bring upon others fell back upon him, and Pharoah lost instead that which was most precious to him (his own son).

Could this not be the way God may work again in history, in our lifetime?

The terrorists seek the destruction of what they call "The Christian West" even as Pharoah sought to kill the firstborn of Israel; could it be that, in the end, God will cause it to be that they will reap the end of Islam as a religion instead? (Which they hold dear.)

There are indeed Greater Forces at work here than those of mere men.

Moses did not wish the death of Pharoah's son, and in the movie, he cries out, "Turn from thy fierce wrath, O Lord!" petitioning that God would cease to do what He had determined to do to the Egyptians. But, as with the case of Moses, if the Lord wills it to be, it will be. In this case, though we do not seek nor wish it (we do yet seek peace in the world) yet the hands of men can be forced to do this if it is His will. It is well to remember that we do not seek to do this but the destinies of the nations are not in human hands.

Dan 4:35 And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and He does according to His will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay His hand, or say to Him, What are you doing?

I hope it will not ever be necessary. However, in the wake of the deaths of millions of Americans, I cannot say that such a course of action would not suggest itself to the grieving minds of the American people. Nor can it be said that God might not move upon hearts to advocate that this course of action be taken. Do you honestly think that NOTHING would be done in return for such acts which cost the lives of millions?

President Bush has shown the world that he is a man who does not draw back from a battle, nor from what he deems to be the correct course of action. It is well if our enemies would note it before they seek to slay us by the millions - for in that case, all options would be on the table, including nuking Mecca. And if God wills it.. "none can stay His hand, or say to Him, "What are you doing!"

Remember also that this nation has once justified dropping two nukes on Japan. The character of this nation may not be to draw back, if God wills it.

Even if you cannot see the hand of God behind those in power, it is there, for the leaders of the nations are just like kings, of whom it is said:

Pro 21:1 The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD, Like the rivers of water; He turns it wherever He wishes.

Sara.

-- July 15, 2005 12:01 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

hello boy and Girls ,can we just save the world in the name of the lord.

No meat and patatoes.

I am a Airman on the ground in Iraq .

-- July 15, 2005 1:00 PM ∞

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Terrance wrote:

Sara -

Props to you girl. That was a fantastic response to Carl's thoughtful post. That was one of your very best - great job.

Carl has a big heart and good wishes for man that stem from a belief that deep down man is good. Unfortunately his world view doesn't have the foundational belief and reality that man is depraved -

Therefore - his ideas, though they sound good are nothing more than pie in the sky ideas - akin to the lyrics of Lennon's "Imagine".

I am out of here for the weekend. Time for some fun with the wife and kids - the beach calls...

Aloha-

T-

-- July 15, 2005 1:11 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Terrance;

Thanks. :)

---

About Einstein..

Einstein was a "convinced pacifist" but not an absolute pacifist. Note that he said (below), "there are circumstances in which in my opinion it is necessary to use force. Such a case would be when I face an opponent whose unconditional aim is to destroy me and my people."

Note also that when the die was cast, and God willed it to be so, even the opposition of so great a man as Einstein could do nothing to prevent the inevitable use of nuclear force, for, as he said, "I could not do anything at all to prevent that fateful decision."

----

Widow publishes husbands private correspondence with Einstein
Einstein's formula to justify A-bomb
AFP July 05, 2005

TOKYO: Previously unpublished letters Albert Einstein wrote to a Japanese pen pal show the physicist to have been defensive over the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, which became possible through his genius.

Einstein's opposition to nuclear warfare has already been documented, but his letters to Shinohara also show him defending himself on a personal level and trying to reconcile his pacifism.

The correspondence began in 1953 when Shinohara sent a letter to Einstein criticising the physicist over his role in developing nuclear weapons.

Einstein responded by hand on the back of the typed letter, beginning his rebuttal without bothering to offer greetings.

"I have always condemned the use of the atomic bomb against Japan but I could not do anything at all to prevent that fateful decision," Einstein wrote in German to Shinohara in a letter dated June 23, 1953.

"The only consolation, it seems to me, in the development of nuclear bombs is that this time the deterrent effect will prevail and the development of international security will accelerate," Einstein wrote in another letter.

But Einstein, whose Jewish origins led him to flee Germany in 1933 for the US after Adolf Hitler came to power, also said war was sometimes acceptable.

"I didn't write that I was an absolute pacifist but that I have always been a convinced pacifist. That means there are circumstances in which in my opinion it is necessary to use force," he wrote.

"Such a case would be when I face an opponent whose unconditional aim is to destroy me and my people."

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0%2C5744%2C15825550%25255E2703%2C00.html

-- July 15, 2005 2:00 PM ∞

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Capt'n wrote:

Just to get my notes correct.......

Where is the Pig Roast, on what Island and who is buying the first round?

-- July 15, 2005 6:29 PM ∞

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Lila Mcracken wrote:

This is an interesting site. The Watch/listen link on the left takes you to a video on "Academic Terrorism". Gives you a look at the diffence in culture.
http://www.levitt.tv/

Lila

-- July 15, 2005 7:25 PM ∞

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Sporter wrote:

CNN Tonight July 15th, 10:00 est. Iraq

-- July 15, 2005 7:53 PM ∞

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Bobby Floyd wrote:

Sara: You are magnificent. Your posts are intellectual and informative and reflect considerable research. Keep this good info coming.

Carl: I have read every post you have made and have always agreed 100% with you; however, your last post sounded like some Vermont professor with an agenda. I continue to esteem you highly, but please revert back to the old Carl.

As I have posted many times, security is the key to our investment in the dinar paying off. Again, we have to create a situation in Iraq whereby the price is too great for anyone to pursue terrorist ambitions. There is no way to solve this situation in a calm and civilized way.
Find the terrorist and kill them and rid our civilization of these cancers who are costing our Country extreme financial loss and more importantly the blood of our soldiers.

Lets get tough and solve the security situation and bring our soldiers home and raise the price of the dinar in the process.

BOB

-- July 15, 2005 10:41 PM ∞

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Sporter wrote:

"Iraq Progress" which aired tonight on CNN was very fair. My friends we have a long way too go.

God Bless!

-- July 15, 2005 10:58 PM ∞

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Carl wrote:

DON'T MAKE THE MISTAKE OF MISJUDGING
Don't mistake anyone's attempt to resolve issues without killing, as a weakness, or being afraid to fight. Killing someone is not hard to do. Attempting to resolve conflicts without violence between parties who hate each other is difficult, and shows true strength and character of leadership.
If history has shown us anything, is that intolerance, creates intolerance. The Iraqi insurgents, who are a very minor percentage of the muslims in Iraq, are intolerant of all who do not believe as they do. They have no will or intentions of trying to co-exist with anyone who disagrees with them.
Their actions and attitudes have placed them in a position, where they should be eliminated with prejudice.
They are worse than wild packs of animals. Animals hunt with instinct, humans such as these, commit their atrocities with planning and forth thought. They have no remorse as to the mayhem of their actions. I am totally against holding any of these individuals for any other reason than to extract information.Once that has been done, they should be executed immediately.
Sadly, that only removes one individual, who is then replaced with another, who thinks just as she or he did. Thus the cycle continues, and nothing is resolved in bloodshed. Unfortunately, I also understand, this is also a necessary part in protecting your own, until time allows other efforts to take place.
History has shown the way to change someone or a communities views is by changing attitudes, prejudices, hearts, minds and remove the sting of bitterness toward another.
Children are just one way to resolve conflicts. They are like clean slates. They can be taught to hate, or taught to co-exist with another. Because they only know what they have been told about another race or faith, it is easy mold them into whatever, the adults wish for them to believe.
Human nature does not change over night,day, week,month, or year/ It takes years to remove ingrained prejudices.(If anything, we know this to be a fact illustrated by our own history) Until the leaders of Iraq, allow and sometimes force certain areas of their country to let children of different races, tribes, faiths to co-mingle, and see that each are no different than they are,to allow them over years to build friendships and work together in building their communities. the violence will continue.
The old attitudes have to die out, and be replaced with more tolerant attitudes toward one another on both sides.
Failure of the middle east leaders to do this, only continues the violence, so demostrated to the world by the years of conflict in the gaza strip.
So! Terrance, to make lite of my attitude toward changing hearts and minds is to ignore history. My suggestions of this method is no pie in the sky attitude. It is a fact, that without this effort, nothing changes except the people who are killed and replaced by more people who will be killed and then replaced by more people who will be killed.
To indict a whole race, or faith on either side, because of the actions of a small percentage of extremist is wrong and irresponsible. This only incites more hatrid, and prejudices, with the end result being more bloodshed on both sides.
Unless these type of efforts are taken, I firmly believe the end result is Iraq's economy will continue to suffer, and the middle east will still be in same quadmire of hatrid 100 years from now.
I just don't think I can hang on that long to cash out my dinar.

-- July 15, 2005 11:46 PM ∞

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Ziarian wrote:

You All people Must Read these comments to see real Face of Islam !

Question:

Doesn’t Islam promote violence, bloodshed and brutality since the Qur’an says that Muslims should kill the kuffar where ever they find them?

Answer:

A few selected verses from the Qur’an are often misquoted to perpetuate the myth that Islam promotes violence, and exhorts its followers to kill those outside the pale of Islam.

1. Verse from Surah Taubah
The following verse from Surah Taubah is very often quoted by critics of Islam, to show that Islam promotes violence, bloodshed and brutality:

"Kill the mushriqeen (pagans, polytheists, kuffar) where ever you find them."
[Al-Qur’an 9:5]

2. Context of verse is during battlefield
Critics of Islam actually quote this verse out of context. In order to understand the context, we need to read from verse 1 of this surah. It says that there was a peace treaty between the Muslims and the Mushriqs (pagans) of Makkah. This treaty was violated by the Mushriqs of Makkah. A period of four months was given to the Mushriqs of Makkah to make amends. Otherwise war would be declared against them. Verse 5 of Surah Taubah says:

"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is oft-forgiving, Most merciful."
[Al-Qur’an 9:5]

This verse is quoted during a battle.

3. Example of war between America and Vietnam
We know that America was once at war with Vietnam. Suppose the President of America or the General of the American Army told the American soldiers during the war: "Wherever you find the Vietnamese, kill them". Today if I say that the American President said, "Wherever you find Vietnamese, kill them" without giving the context, I will make him sound like a butcher. But if I quote him in context, that he said it during a war, it will sound very logical, as he was trying to boost the morale of the American soldiers during the war.

4. Verse 9:5 quoted to boost morale of Muslims during battle

Similarly in Surah Taubah chapter 9 verse 5 the Qur’an says, "Kill the Mushriqs where ever you find them", during a battle to boost the morale of the Muslim soldiers. What the Qur’an is telling Muslim soldiers is, don’t be afraid during battle; wherever you find the enemies kill them.

5. Shourie jumps from verse 5 to verse 7
Arun Shourie is one of the staunchest critics of Islam in India. He quotes the same verse, Surah Taubah chapter 9 verse 5 in his book ‘The World of Fatwahs’, on page 572. After quoting verse 5 he jumps to verse 7 of Surah Taubah. Any sensible person will realise that he has skipped verse 6.

6. Surah Taubah chapter 9 verse 6 gives the answer
Surah Taubah chapter 9 verse 6 gives the answer to the allegation that Islam promotes violence, brutality and bloodshed. It says:

"If one amongst the pagans ask thee for asylum,grant it to him, so that he may hear the word of Allah; and then escort him to where he can be secure that is because they are men without knowledge."
[Al-Qur’an 9:6]

The Qur’an not only says that a Mushriq seeking asylum during the battle should be granted refuge, but also that he should be escorted to a secure place. In the present international scenario, even a kind, peace-loving army General, during a battle, may let the enemy soldiers go free, if they want peace. But which army General will ever tell his soldiers, that if the enemy soldiers want peace during a battle, don’t just let them go free, but also escort them to a place of security?

This is exactly what Allah (swt) says in the Glorious Qur’an to promote peace in the world.

-- July 16, 2005 6:31 AM ∞

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Ziarian wrote:

Question:

Why are most of the Muslims fundamentalists and terrorists?

Answer:

This question is often hurled at Muslims, either directly or indirectly, during any discussion on religion or world affairs. Muslim stereotypes are perpetuated in every form of the media accompanied by gross misinformation about Islam and Muslims. In fact, such misinformation and false propaganda often leads to discrimination and acts of violence against Muslims. A case in point is the anti-Muslim campaign in the American media following the Oklahoma bomb blast, where the press was quick to declare a ‘Middle Eastern conspiracy’ behind the attack. The culprit was later identified as a soldier from the American Armed Forces.

Let us analyze this allegation of ‘fundamentalism’ and ‘terrorism’:

1. Definition of the word ‘fundamentalist’

A fundamentalist is a person who follows and adheres to the fundamentals of the doctrine or theory he is following. For a person to be a good doctor, he should know, follow, and practise the fundamentals of medicine. In other words, he should be a fundamentalist in the field of medicine. For a person to be a good mathematician, he should know, follow and practise the fundamentals of mathematics. He should be a fundamentalist in the field of mathematics. For a person to be a good scientist, he should know, follow and practise the fundamentals of science. He should be a fundamentalist in the field of science.

2. Not all ‘fundamentalists’ are the same

One cannot paint all fundamentalists with the same brush. One cannot categorize all fundamentalists as either good or bad. Such a categorization of any fund amentalist will depend upon the field or activity in which he is a fundamentalist. A fundamentalist robber or thief causes harm to society and is therefore undesirable. A fundamentalist doctor, on the other hand, benefits society and earns much respect.

3. I am proud to be a Muslim fundamentalist

I am a fundamentalist Muslim who, by the grace of Allah, knows, follows and strives to practise the fundamentals of Islam. A true Muslim does not shy away from being a fundamentalist. I am proud to be a fundamentalist Muslim because, I know that the fundamentals of Islam are beneficial to humanity and the whole world. There is not a single fundamental of Islam that causes harm or is against the interests of the human race as a whole. Many people harbour misconceptions about Islam and consider several teachings of Islam to be unfair or improper. This is due to insufficient and incorrect knowledge of Islam. If one critically analyzes the teachings of Islam with an open mind, one cannot escape the fact that Islam is full of benefits both at the individual and collective levels.

4. Dictionary meaning of the word ‘fundamentalist’

According to Webster’s dictionary ‘fundamentalism’ was a movement in American Protestanism that arose in the earlier part of the 20th century. It was a reaction to modernism, and stressed the infallibility of the Bible, not only in matters of faith and morals but also as a literal historical record. It stressed on belief in the Bible as the literal word of God. Thus fundamentalism was a word initially used for a group of Christians who believed that the Bible was the verbatim word of God without any errors and mistakes.

According to the Oxford dictionary ‘fundamentalism’ means ‘strict maintenance of ancient or fundamental doctrines of any religion, especially Islam’.

Today the moment a person uses the word fundamentalist he thinks of a Muslim who is a terrorist.

5. Every Muslim should be a terrorist

Every Muslim should be a terrorist. A terrorist is a person who causes terror. The moment a robber sees a policeman he is terrified. A policeman is a terrorist for the robber. Similarly every Muslim should be a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society, such as thieves, dacoits and rapists. Whenever such an anti-social element sees a Muslim, he should be terrified. It is true that the word ‘terrorist’ is generally used for a person who causes terror among the common people. But a true Muslim should only be a terrorist to selective people i.e. anti-social elements, and not to the common innocent people. In fact a Muslim should be a source of peace for innocent people.

6. Different labels given to the same individual for the same action, i.e. ‘terrorist’ and ‘patriot’

Before India achieved independence from British rule, some freedom fighters of India who did not subscribe to non-violence were labeled as terrorists by the British government. The same individuals have been lauded by Indians for the same activities and hailed as ‘patriots’. Thus two different labels have been given to the same people for the same set of actions. One is calling him a terrorist while the other is calling him a patriot. Those who believed that Britain had a right to rule over India called these people terrorists, while those who were of the view that Britain had no right to rule India called them patriots and freedom fighters.

It is therefore important that before a person is judged, he is given a fair hearing. Both sides of the argument should be heard, the situation should be analyzed, and the reason and the intention of the person should be taken into account, and then the person can be judged accordingly.

7. Islam means peace

Islam is derived from the word ‘salaam’ which means peace. It is a religion of peace whose fundamentals teach its followers to maintain and promote peace throughout the world.

Thus every Muslim should be a fundamentalist i.e. he should follow the fundamentals of the Religion of Peace: Islam. He should be a terrorist only towards the antisocial elements in order to promote peace and justice in the society.

-- July 16, 2005 6:35 AM ∞

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Ziarian wrote:

Question:

How can Islam be called the religion of peace when it was spread by the sword?

Answer:

It is a common complaint among some non-Muslims that Islam would not have millions of adherents all over the world, if it had not been spread by the use of force. The following points will make it clear, that far from being spread by the sword, it was the inherent force of truth, reason and logic that was responsible for the rapid spread of Islam.

1. Islam means peace.

Islam comes from the root word ‘salaam’, which means peace. It also means submitting one’s will to Allah (swt). Thus Islam is a religion of peace, which is acquired by submitting one’s will to the will of the Supreme Creator, Allah (swt).

2. Sometimes force has to be used to maintain peace.

Each and every human being in this world is not in favour of maintaining peace and harmony. There are many, who would disrupt it for their own vested interests. Sometimes force has to be used to maintain peace. It is precisely for this reason that we have the police who use force against criminals and anti-social elements to maintain peace in the country. Islam promotes peace. At the same time, Islam exhorts it followers to fight where there is oppression. The fight against oppression may, at times, require the use of force. In Islam force can only be used to promote peace and justice.

3. Opinion of historian De Lacy O’Leary.

The best reply to the misconception that Islam was spread by the sword is given by the noted historian De Lacy O’Leary in the book "Islam at the cross road" (Page 8):

"History makes it clear however, that the legend of fanatical Muslims sweeping through the world and forcing Islam at the point of the sword upon conquered races is one of the most fantastically absurd myth that historians have ever repeated."

4. Muslims ruled Spain for 800 years.

Muslims ruled Spain for about 800 years. The Muslims in Spain never used the sword to force the people to convert. Later the Christian Crusaders came to Spain and wiped out the Muslims. There was not a single Muslim in Spain who could openly give the adhan, that is the call for prayers.

5. 14 million Arabs are Coptic Christians.

Muslims were the lords of Arabia for 1400 years. For a few years the British ruled, and for a few years the French ruled. Overall, the Muslims ruled Arabia for 1400 years. Yet today, there are 14 million Arabs who are Coptic Christians i.e. Christians since generations. If the Muslims had used the sword there would not have been a single Arab who would have remained a Christian.

6. More than 80% non-Muslims in India.

The Muslims ruled India for about a thousand years. If they wanted, they had the power of converting each and every non-Muslim of India to Islam. Today more than 80% of the population of India are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Indians are bearing witness today that Islam was not spread by the sword.

7. Indonesia and Malaysia.

Indonesia is a country that has the maximum number of Muslims in the world. The majority of people in Malaysia are Muslims. May one ask, "Which Muslim army went to Indonesia and Malaysia?"

8. East Coast of Africa.

Similarly, Islam has spread rapidly on the East Coast of Africa. One may again ask, if Islam was spread by the sword, "Which Muslim army went to the East Coast of Africa?"

9. Thomas Carlyle.

The famous historian, Thomas Carlyle, in his book "Heroes and Hero worship", refers to this misconception about the spread of Islam: "The sword indeed, but where will you get your sword? Every new opinion, at its starting is precisely in a minority of one. In one man’s head alone. There it dwells as yet. One man alone of the whole world believes it, there is one man against all men. That he takes a sword and try to propagate with that, will do little for him. You must get your sword! On the whole, a thing will propagate itself as it can."

10. No compulsion in religion.

With which sword was Islam spread? Even if Muslims had it they could not use it to spread Islam because the Qur’an says in the following verse:

"Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error"[Al-Qur’an 2:256]

11. Sword of the Intellect.

It is the sword of intellect. The sword that conquers the hearts and minds of people. The Qur’an says in Surah Nahl, chapter 16 verse 125:

"Invite (all) to the way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious." [Al-Qur’an 16:125]

12. Increase in the world religions from 1934 to 1984.

An article in Reader’s Digest ‘Almanac’, year book 1986, gave the statistics of the increase of percentage of the major religions of the world in half a century from 1934 to 1984. This article also appeared in ‘The Plain Truth’ magazine. At the top was Islam, which increased by 235%, and Christianity had increased only by 47%. May one ask, which war took place in this century which converted millions of people to Islam?

13. Islam is the fastest growing religion in America and Europe.

Today the fastest growing religion in America is Islam. The fastest growing religion in Europe in Islam. Which sword is forcing people in the West to accept Islam in such large numbers?

14. Dr. Joseph Adam Pearson.

Dr. Joseph Adam Pearson rightly says, "People who worry that nuclear weaponry will one day fall in the hands of the Arabs, fail to realize that the Islamic bomb has been dropped already, it fell the day MUHAMMED (pbuh) was born".

-- July 16, 2005 6:40 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Ziarian:
Thank you for the information about Islam. I firmly believe, more knowledge about a subject renders benefits to all.
Christians have many different christian beliefs.That is why in America we have,Freewill Baptist,AMC Baptist,Emmanuel Missionary Baptist Church, Calvary Baptist Churches, First Baptist, Southern Baptist, Christian Fellowship Baptist,Christian Mission Baptist, Primitive Baptist Church,Church of Christ,First Assembly of God, Church of God, Church of God of Prophecy,Catholic Church, Church of God in Christ, First Presbyterian Church,Episcopal Church, First Church of the Nazarene,New Beginning Church, New Ministries, Mary's Church of the Nazarene, Friendship Community Churches, Disciples of Christ Church, Lutheran Church, First United Methodist Church, United Methodist, New Life Churches, New Birth Churches, New Wine Ministries, Redeemer Presbyterian churches,Friendship Redeemer Centers, St. Paul CME Church, Saint Michaels Church, The Greater ST.Paul. AME Church, Apostolic Lighthouse Centers, The Apostolic Church of God, The Church of the Latter Day Saints,Evangelical Lutheran,The Full Gospel Churches, The Interdenominational Church, The Jehovah's Witnesses Church,Independent Methodist,First Methodist Chruch,Methodist CME, Independent Methodist,Church of the Pentecost, Reformed Presbyterian Church,Seventh Day Adventist, Unitarian church, Unitarian Universalist Church, etc;;;
Heck I haven't even got to the Catholic diversity, the Greek Churches, The Italian Churches, But I believe you get the idea.
This just a small example of churches that exist in a mid size southern town, much less a large city. Everyone of these churches preach the doctrine, their way is the superior way back to heaven. That all others are misinterpreting, misquoting, mis-whatever, and are teaching christ's history and path wrongly.
They all claim to have the ear of god, and he agrees with "THEIR WAY OF TEACHING THE FAITH"
They are like children in a play ground, screaming "its mine and you can't have it if you don't play by my rules".
So! the christian groupS expects you "Tha Islamic Worshippers" to all agree to one method of teaching. They tend to point out a certain verses, yet, fail to mention, that is the teachings of only one sect of Islam, while indicting the entire faith of Islam. Not bothering to look in the mirror at their own diversity of teachings.
They can't stand each other, much less keep from condeming another faith. These so call, "we tolerate all faiths in America", Why doesn't Islam?, fail to mention it was their diversity that ran the mormons, quakers, and dutch reformist out of the eastern part of the United States with beatings, hangings, raids, etc.. What was their crime. They didn't worship as the powerful established church leaders expected, so they were considered heretics.
When the finger points back, it tends to shoot the truth. God! must be shaking his head at these children as they play at pretending to be wise.

How many forms of Islamic beliefs are there? Is that faith just as diverse as the christian faith? What form of Islam or view of Islam do the Insurgents practice? It is obviously not a very popular view, or the entire Muslim society would embrace it, and we would be fighting all muslims, not just a small percentage.
How many sects or views of Islam are there?
I bring these questions, up only because certain radical groups use the Islam faith as their banner in the battle for Iraq. These battles have a direct affect on the valuation of the dinar.

-- July 16, 2005 9:25 AM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Religous Intolerance....

Ziarian;

In your first post you said:
"It says that there was a peace treaty between the Muslims and the Mushriqs (pagans) of Makkah. This treaty was violated by the Mushriqs of Makkah."

Yet note that the Koran says to the Muslims, as previously quoted:

"If you fear treachery from any of your allies, you may fairly retaliate by breaking off your treaty with them." (Surah 8:51-)

In context.. WHY did these supposed 'pagans' break off their peace treaty with the Muslims? (Something the Muslims are allowed to do according to this verse if there is treachery involved?)

You say:
"A period of four months was given to the Mushriqs of Makkah to make amends. Otherwise war would be declared against them."

In context, then, what were the exact demands placed upon these supposedly pagan people that they felt it was so unreasonable that they had to break off the treaty with the Muslims? And why are Muslims allowed to break a treaty for treachery, but war is declared against those of the pagans who do not give in to the demands of the Muslims? Is that quite fair, to allow Muslims to break a treaty, but not others in what could very well be similar circumstances?

You quote the Vietnam war, but do not give us the REASONS the 'pagans' in the verse you quoted broke off the treaty. Without that, we cannot properly judge whether they were breaking that treaty for Muslim treachery or not. And the fact that they were given four months until open war was declared also means that the grievance appeared to be unreconcilable.. again I ask.. what was the grievance?

From the context of the verses, I argue that it was that the 'pagans' would NOT give in and take the Muslim god Allah as their god - that it was for their lack of religious conversion to Islam - something which we view as a lack of freedom of religion.

You quote:

"... but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is oft-forgiving, Most merciful."
[Al-Qur’an 9:5]

Do you see then that here, the reason they were fighting and declaring war against these 'pagans' is that they would not take their god allah and establish prayers TO HIM, turning from their own convictions and gods and REPENTING from following these other gods than allah. Then they would receive MERCY from the "oft-FORGIVING" god allah. In other words, they needed to pray and repent to allah, ask his FORGIVENESS, and obtain his mercy. Only then would the Muslims "open the way for them".

In our country, freedom to worship whichever god you wish is a right we cherish. We do not make war against people for not adhering to our particular faith. The Lord Jesus Christ said to "shake off the dust of your feet" from those who disagree with you.. not to declare war against them and slaughter them for their unbelief. Muslims are told to declare holy war against the unbelievers and slay them. We do not slay unbelievers with the sword. It is viewed in our country as religious intolerance and arrogance to slay people for their sincere religious convictions, just because they differ with your own. That is the crux of the matter.

You note that the verse not quoted in between the bloodthirsty ones is:

"If one amongst the pagans ask thee for asylum,grant it to him, so that he may hear the word of Allah; and then escort him to where he can be secure that is because they are men without knowledge."
[Al-Qur’an 9:6]

Note that the 'mercy' being given is "so that he may hear the word of Allah... that is because they are men without knowledge."

The thought given here is that, IF they change their religious convictions, upon being told of the words of the Koran, (for they were without knowledge of the True Way of Islam before) they will be allowed to live. But there is not in this view the idea that if they DO NOT change their religious convictions, they will then be allowed to go free.. and remain in that safe place they have escorted them to or be released.

If these 'pagans' choose to remain estranged from the god allah, if they remain 'pagans' from the Islamic religious fold, the verse before and after it says that they are to be slaughtered for their infidelity to what the Koran teaches is the "only true god allah and his prophet Mohammed".

This leaves very little leeway for any other views to be discussed in an open fashion, (without coersion). It also does not allow any peace to be established which would allow others to retain what we in this country feel are God given rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. This view violates all three of those aims. A truly FREE people must be able to choose their religious beliefs without coersion of the sword and pursue what they feel is the right course for them. We defend in this country YOUR right to choose to follow your god allah, if you so wish to believe in him. We do not force you to any other faith against your will. We defend all people's freedom to choose, free of all encumberances and mental reservations, what they feel is the right path in this life for them. THAT FREEDOM is what the terrorists hate, and the Koran here teaches that Muslims must fight against such freedom of religious conscience. To be 'wrong' in your religious choices, according the Koran's view, means war and death to the 'pagans' and 'infidels', not tolerance of other people's sincerely held religious convictions.

Sara.

-- July 16, 2005 10:10 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Sara:
I find it interesting the attack position you took on the post from Ziarian.
In your post you stated, in our country you have the freedom to worship any god you wish, and that is a right we cherish.
we did not make war on people who not adhere to our faith.
I believe you need to ask the mormons, the quakers, the muslims who were attacked by christians during the crusades in the middle east for they were non-believers.
I believe you need to ask the victims of the Salem Witch Hunts, The Victims of the Racks and torture chambers of the early christian church carried out by priest.
Be careful of the stones thrown, for they may deflect and hit square in the head with cold hard facts, history and truth, not history as we wish it would be.

-- July 16, 2005 1:47 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Ziarian;

I think we need to remember that, in discussing this topic on the Dinar Board, we are looking at the terrorists since they are the obstacle to our hopes for Iraq and for our investment in the Dinar. When you say:

"Islam means peace. - Islam comes from the root word ‘salaam’, which means peace. It also means submitting one’s will to Allah (swt). Thus Islam is a religion of peace, which is acquired by submitting one’s will to the will of the Supreme Creator, Allah (swt)."

The belief that Islam brings peace can be your own personal conviction, and I am glad for you if that religion has given you peace. However, for those who do NOT wish to submit their will to your god allah in order to obtain the peace you have, the problem is that the fundamentalist Islamic Jihad terrorists see that as conduct worthy of death. It is what they justify killing people for.

When you look at the conduct of the terrorists and their avowed aims (to promote the message of Islam by violent methods in the world), this does give some impetus to the remarks made which say that it is a religion spread by the sword. In view of the daily reports in the news concerning terrorist acts in the name of Islam, such claims appear to have some justification and those making them are not just whistling in the dark. There is evidence that there are devout adherents to fundamental Islam who are trying to promote it by way of the sword. As you said, this is so to such an extent that, quote:

"According to the Oxford dictionary ‘fundamentalism’ means ‘strict maintenance of ancient or fundamental doctrines of any religion, especially Islam’. Today the moment a person uses the word fundamentalist he thinks of a Muslim who is a terrorist."

When you say "far from being spread by the sword, it was the inherent force of truth, reason and logic that was responsible for the rapid spread of Islam." Let us just say that, in the case in point (Iraq and the terrorists, which is what this board is concerned about) the particular fundamentalist Islamics we are speaking of here are not trying "the inherent force of truth, reason and logic" to spread Islam. It is that which we are discussing and concerned about.

When you say:

"The Muslims ruled India for about a thousand years. Today more than 80% of the population of India are non-Muslims. All these non-Muslim Indians are bearing witness today that Islam was not spread by the sword."

This also gives proof that, given the choice, 80% of the people of India would rather NOT be Muslim. I support them in that choice, and freedom. Would the terrorists do so? Would you as a fundamentalist Islamic support their choice to reject your own religion and the "peace" you have found in it, Ziarian?

When you say:

"Every Muslim should be a terrorist. A terrorist is a person who causes terror. The moment a robber sees a policeman he is terrified. A policeman is a terrorist for the robber. Similarly every Muslim should be a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society, such as thieves, dacoits and rapists. Whenever such an anti-social element sees a Muslim, he should be terrified. It is true that the word ‘terrorist’ is generally used for a person who causes terror among the common people. But a true Muslim should only be a terrorist to selective people i.e. anti-social elements, and not to the common innocent people. In fact a Muslim should be a source of peace for innocent people. Sometimes force has to be used to maintain peace. It is precisely for this reason that we have the police who use force against criminals and anti-social elements to maintain peace in the country. Islam promotes peace. At the same time, Islam exhorts it followers to fight where there is oppression. The fight against oppression may, at times, require the use of force. In Islam force can only be used to promote peace and justice."

What we in our society see this as is vigilante justice. You see, a policeman may indeed deal with antisocial elements, and criminals are brought to due process of law in this country. In this case, you are saying that ALL Muslims should be just like cops, and terrify people who are breaking the law. This would be the equivalent of saying that all people should be like in the days before the sheriffs of the wild west and shoot bad guys. Again, the judgement of who is "anti-social" at this level (ie your quote above, "EVERY Muslim believer should be a terrorist") appears to contain flaws. NO ONE would be afraid of any Muslim believer if he could not back up his "promotion of peace and justice" with force, hence, your advocating "every Muslim should be a terrorist" means vigilante justice.. justice taken into individual's hands. Here in this country we have arrest and then arraignment before a judge, not terror on the streets from every person according to what is right or wrong in their eyes. You say, "Islam exhorts its followers to fight where there is oppression." Who exactly determines what IS oppression? In this case, it is not laws and courts, but Islam's followers.

Maybe an example might help. In one case I read about, a woman's arm was accidentally uncovered as she was driving her car in an Islamic country when she stopped for a traffic light, is that oppressively anti-social? Is it right that she was dragged out of her vehicle and beaten for shamelessly allowing her sleeve to ride up, exposing her bare arm? The problem is the view of what JUSTICE means to an Islamic mind.. and the fact that EACH MUSLIM can determine that for themselves and then act the role of cop upon others. Thus we get these Islamic people who think that, if a woman's cousin committed an indiscretion, the woman should be taken and raped for two days in proper honor as punishment for that crime (and she must be counted 'fortunate' she wasn't killed as many others are).

Article url and quote:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/07/06/pakistan.rape.reut/index.html

MULTAN, Pakistan (Reuters) -- Pakistani police have arrested five men on charges of kidnapping and gang-raping a woman in the latest of a string of so-called honor crimes.

The married woman was attacked because one of her male cousins had an affair with a woman whose father disapproved of the relationship, police said on Wednesday.

Hundreds of women are raped or killed every year by men intent on restoring honor after behavior -- by the woman or a male relative -- deemed inappropriate in the male-dominated society.

In the latest incident, eight men kidnapped the woman, Fauzia Altaf, in the town of Chiniot in late June after the main suspect, Anwar Ali, got angry about an affair between her cousin and his daughter.

Ali was among the five men accused of raping and torturing the woman for two days. Two other suspects had absconded while one had turned himself in and been released on bail, Mumtaz said.

President Pervez Musharraf, who is trying to project Pakistan as a moderate and progressive Muslim nation, last week condemned the violent humiliation of women and said his government was committed to ensuring victims got justice.

-----

Perhaps these hundreds of women who are raped and killed every year in this progressive MUSLIM nation are a taste of what you mean by "every Muslim should be a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society"? These Muslim men certainly felt it was an honorable thing to do. Where did they get that idea from? How can you condemn their actions when you advocate, not the rule of law, but "EVERY Muslim" being "a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society"?

You said:

"I know that the fundamentals of Islam are beneficial to humanity and the whole world. There is not a single fundamental of Islam that causes harm or is against the interests of the human race as a whole. Many people harbour misconceptions about Islam and consider several teachings of Islam to be unfair or improper. This is due to insufficient and incorrect knowledge of Islam. If one critically analyzes the teachings of Islam with an open mind, one cannot escape the fact that Islam is full of benefits both at the individual and collective levels."

You say it is a fundamentally peaceful religion and beneficial to humanity "as a whole". Yet you admit that "many people.. consider several teachings of Islam to be unfair or improper". Perhaps these honor killings and rapings are a case in point. If there is nothing in Islam to cause harm to these women, why are honor killings and rapings happening in this Muslim country by the hundreds? Is it really due to "insufficient and incorrect knowledge of Islam"? Or will you argue that "AS A WHOLE" it makes for a more peaceful and orderly society, since it deters people from immoral conduct, and that thus it is justifiable for the Muslim who is supposed to be a terrror to all anti-social elements of society?

You said:

"Different labels given to the same individual for the same action, i.e. ‘terrorist’ and ‘patriot’. Two different labels have been given to the same people for the same set of actions. One is calling him a terrorist while the other is calling him a patriot. It is therefore important that before a person is judged, he is given a fair hearing. Both sides of the argument should be heard, the situation should be analyzed, and the reason and the intention of the person should be taken into account, and then the person can be judged accordingly."

In the case I mentioned above, these men (and hundreds like them) believe honor killings and rapings are right and fully justifiable to keep the "peace" of Islam and the honor of the people of that religion pure. I am sure they do not consider themselves terrorists, but those maintaining HONOR and JUSTICE in their communities. Indeed, they think of themselves with another label than that of "terrorist". Their INTENTION as you said, is probably good. So are the terrorist's INTENTIONS, which are to spread their heartfelt beliefs about Islam. It is the METHOD of obtaining what they feel is honorable and true JUSTICE that we object to.

When you say:

".. every Muslim should be a fundamentalist i.e. he should follow the fundamentals of the Religion of Peace: Islam. He should be a terrorist only towards the antisocial elements in order to promote peace and justice in the society."

The problem comes in when we are trying to figure out what promotes justice or peace. I just discussed one of the views of Islamic justice, and since you defined peace as meaning peace with allah and submitting to his will.. if you do NOT choose to submit to allah's will, are you against the peace of society? What is the cost of rejecting the peace of allah that is in the "interests of the human race AS A WHOLE" and the peace of Islamic society in particular as you said? What cost is associated with rejecting the way of peace of allah, that freedom of choice, in an Islamic country, say, in Saudi Arabia? They seem quite intolerant of those who do not wish to follow the peaceful way of allah.

From Carl's post: http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#12783

"Saudi Arabia.. is the most repressive country in the middle east with no tolerance of any other faith, journalists sacked and deported who do not write of their country in a favorable light, .. (they) refuse basic rights to a majority of their citizens."

Why do those in power who are Islamic in Saudi Arabia have "no tolerance of any other faith" and "refuse basic rights to a majority of their citizens"?

I was reading a Middle Eastern gentleman yesterday, Mohammed A.R. Galadari, the editor in chief of Khaleej Times, Dubai (may God protect him for speaking out and no harm come to him there) and he said the reason there was not demonstrations in the street against terrorism was:

"Before saying that there's no expression of sorrow or holding of demonstrations in the Muslim capitals, they (the West) should have known the fact that this is not possible. Such open expression of views is not allowed in these countries. The Arab republics are republics only in name. They are ruled by dictators under emergency laws. So much so, people are not allowed to have a mind of their own. And, now you expect of them to get onto the streets and demonstrate?... Much of those in the Arab and Muslim world have not been witness to progress, especially so in the republics, and they are not allowed to have their voice. They can't exercise their freedom in many ways. And they cannot raise their voice. How can you expect of them to show their anger on the streets, the way the West expects of them to? Gatherings and demonstrations are not allowed under emergency laws. How would they show how much they are upset and how horrible they feel about murderers and those who use websites to make horrible claims? So, don't say they haven't come out on the streets and said loudly to terrorists, "Don't do this". They are saying so in their hearts, but they cannot do so by their mouths. That's their predicament."

http://www.arabnews.com/?page=7§ion=0&article=66969&d=15&m=7&y=2005

If Islam is such a great religion, why is there so little freedom for the people under its rulership?

I agree with the verse:

"Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error"[Al-Qur’an 2:256]"

Does this apply to the Islamic countries and their people, such as Saudi Arabia? If there is to be no compulsion in religion, why do they have "no tolerance of any other faith"? Why does this man say they can only object in their hearts, but they cannot do so by their mouths?

I ask the context of the verse just quoted about no compulsion in religion. In context, is the word RELIGION in this verse (which is easy to take to mean ALL religions) really meant as instruction only to the adherents of the "True Religion of allah"? In other words, is the intent of the passage to say to Muslim worshippers (for the Koran is written to them, not the world):

"Let there be no compulsion (among the brothers and sisters of Islam) in (our) religion: Truth (from the Koran, will) stand out clear from error (to you believers)."

You would have to prove it to be unequivocally to the world, and not just instruction for believers in allah to win this point, particularly in light of the other passages advocating slaying the infidels and utterly subduing them, such as these two:

"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and god's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"Fight against such as those to whom the Scriptures were given [Jews and Christians]...until they pay tribute out of hand and are utterly subdued." (Surah 9:27-)

These words do seem to be at odds with those of "Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from error".

I do admire the attempt to use the sword of the intellect when you quote:

"Invite (all) to the way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious." [Al-Qur’an 16:125]

How come these words do not strike home with the terrorists? Because it ALSO says in the Koran that if they will not receive your "wisdom and beautiful preaching" when you "argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious" that what they are to do next is to fight against such "idolatry". The two verses quoted just above said that such "idolatry" is worse than the resulting carnage they are to bring upon those who will not adhere to their religion.

The Koran also says to "Fight against them until idolatry is no more and god's religion reigns supreme". Unfortunately, the fundamentalist Jihad terrorists do not think that these verses refer to the sword of the intellect, and that unbelievers are never to be forced under compulsion to accept Islam. They do not believe these verses refer to an isolated incident on some battlefield at some time in the past, but that these are eternal words of wisdom for all fundamental adherents of the religion of Islam for all time. And it is the views of the terrorists which we are dealing with here because they most affect us, the security of our countries in the West... and the Dinar.

Sara.

-- July 16, 2005 2:25 PM ∞

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jimmy p (james pegelow) wrote:

A followup to james hghes July 14 concern with a non performing broker in Chicago, a fellow I work with also had similar performance experiences with the same outfit.

I continue to promote people to purchase their dinars from a trustworthy group in Arizona that has stock on hand. You can learn more by studying this website: http://www.myfreedinar.com/iraq
I gladly pay a little more for the bills there because I know their dinar is on hand and my money is not used to finance other projects. You can get overnight delivery too if you are willing to pay the upcharge.

I also realize that our window of dinar buying opportunity at these historically low levels begins to close once the United States and the World Bank recognizes the Iraqi Dinar as an official currency on the world market.

I pose this question: If the dinar was worth $3.00 per dinar with Saddam in power as oil was trading at under $20.00 per barrel, how much could one expect to see the dinar worth in a post Saddam world where oil trades at $60.00 per barrel?

-- July 16, 2005 2:58 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

This post is religious in nature, a reply to Carl's post, since he asked in his last post and directed it to me. It may have indirect bearing on things, but is basically just replying to Carl's last post to me about people who say they are following Jesus Christ but do not.

Tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and to every good work reprobate.

Carl;

You accuse those who carried out abominable evils against others in the name of Jesus Christ of making "war on people who do not adhere to their faith". I ask you, was "their faith" the same faith advocated by Jesus Christ, as judged by His words, life and works? Did they truly make war on people with the sanction of Jesus Christ, the One they said was their God?

The words of Jesus Christ Himself are instructional in this point:

Mat 7:18-23 A good tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a corrupt tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore by their fruits you will know them.

Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonderful works in Your name?'

And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice iniquity!'
---------

I note that many you spoke of in your posts did not bring forth good fruit, though they did call Jesus 'LORD LORD'. It is doubtful that He will ever own them as His own, but He will instead say to them "depart from Me, you who practice iniquity (iniquity is sin - like killing, torturing, etc)... I NEVER KNEW YOU!" in that Day of Judgement.

It is important to note that THEY say they know Jesus.. but Jesus does not own that He knows them! These verses tell you how you can tell who is a true Christian, by their fruit. Did those you quoted in your posts as Christians follow His example and do the will of His Father in Heaven? If not, you are not speaking of Christians, but wolves.

The Apostle Paul warned of this before he died:

Act 20:29 For I know this, that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock.

Act 20:30 Also from among your own selves men will rise up, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after themselves.

Act 20:31 Therefore watch, and remember that for three years I did not cease to warn everyone night and day with tears.

And again, Jesus spoke of these wolves among His sheep...

Joh 10:11-14 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep. But a hireling, he who is not the shepherd, one who does not own the sheep, sees the wolf coming and leaves the sheep and flees; and the wolf catches the sheep and scatters them. The hireling flees because he is a hireling and does not care about the sheep. I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own.

These are your "cold hard facts, history and truth", Carl. There are wolves who do come among the sheep, both from outside and from inside, for, from among the very fold of believing Christians was predicted to rise men who would draw away diciples AFTER THEMSELVES and not after Jesus Christ. But, yet, Jesus is there among the SHEEP.. and He says he OWNS the sheep and He knows His sheep and is known by His own.

You are right, these wolves will say with their lips "Lord, Lord" but their works betray their true character. Does that fit with your "cold hard facts of history"? I think that the problem is that you are mistaking the wolves for being true disciples of Jesus Christ. They are not His. He will never own them as His own. Their works testify they did not do the works of Jesus nor of His Father in Heaven. Quite obviously, there is only ONE Good Shepherd, and these persons to whom you refer in history were NOT of Him. I do not defend them, they will not escape from His judgement in that day.

Rom 2:3, 5-6 And do you think this, O man, you who judge those practicing such things, and doing the same, that you will escape the judgment of God? But in accordance with your hardness and your impenitent heart you are treasuring up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who "will render to each one according to his deeds":

God will render to those whom you stated abused His name and did wicked things in His name "according to their deeds". You therefore do not need to worry about them, or the vengence due to their heinous crimes, God will see to it. You are right that many "are misinterpreting, misquoting, mis-whatever, and are teaching christ's history and path wrongly. They all claim to have the ear of god, and he agrees with "THEIR WAY OF TEACHING THE FAITH"

You go on to say, quote, "it was their diversity that ran the mormons, quakers, and dutch reformist out of the eastern part of the United States with beatings, hangings, raids, etc.. What was their crime. They didn't worship as the powerful established church leaders expected, so they were considered heretics."

Jesus can handle that. He knew it would happen. He says that He is patient and can fully repay them "according to their deeds" one day, maybe soon, maybe not until later, but they will be repaid. A thousand years is like but one day to the Eternal God. He says we, all human flesh, are like grass that springs up and then withers away, so frail and fleeting.

1Pe 1:24 For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withers, and its flower falls away: But the word of the Lord endures for ever.

Those who teach His path WRONGLY and do evil works in this life He will repay. It is wrong what they did, however, to tar with the brush of those wolves all who are God's sheep is not right either. To call the entire flock wolves is not truthful.

Rom 11:1, 2, 5 I say then, has God cast away His people? God forbid. God has not cast away His people which He foreknew. Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

God never casts His own sheep away from Him. It is not of His character to do so. It is wrong of you to say all Christians are wicked because some evil persons rose up from among them and did wicked things in His Name, saying, "Lord, Lord". God's sheep hear His voice and another voice they will not follow:

Joh 10:27-30 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow me: And I give to them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall anyone pluck them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. I and my Father are one.

No wolf can pluck one of God's own from His hand. The sheep and the wolves are not the same. You do a grave injustice before God when you impute to the righteous the folly of the wicked.

You must not judge a movement which takes after a leader by those who claim to follow that leader, for there will be those who say they follow that leader but do not. In the case of Islam, I seek always to judge it by its words (in the Koran) and its founder Mohammed's life, words and example FIRST and then by the fruit the religion shows as it works among men (to see how closely they adhere to the founder's ideals). That is why I went so carefully over the verses in the Koran in my reply to Ziarian. If the case you are making fails to be proven by the founder's words, ideals and example, then you need go no farther, really. In the case of Christianity, it is the same. Jesus never advocated any of those evil works they did in His name, now, did He, Carl? Indeed He said:

Mat 5:20 For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Sara.

-- July 16, 2005 5:52 PM ∞

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Vador wrote:

Sare,

Not trying to pick or pry at ya, I just had to ask if you think people really read those long posts or are you just home bored silly and use the time to post here.

Love readin, but usually end up skipping a lot of what is posted on this DINAR blog

John

-- July 16, 2005 7:20 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Hey folk, i am an american service man in Iraq. I know everything, i am a SGT. Hehehe Remind us of anyone.

By the way this board is not about the facts of the dinar , but about the bible , koran and other holy books. Lots of experts here.

Some have nothing to do but write long useless post.

Doesthis ring a bell, does the cap fit. (S#####)

-- July 16, 2005 11:34 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

To Post or not to Post...

Vador;

You know what the trouble is.. I'm female.

"The first Adam-splitting gave us Eve, a force which men in all ages have never gotten under control."

---

And a Pacifist, too..

A burglar entered the house of a Quaker and proceeded to rob it. The Quaker heard noises, took his shotgun downstairs, and found the burglar. He aimed his gun and said gently: "Friend, I mean thee no harm, but thou standest where I am about to shoot."

---

I suppose there are worse uses for time than replying to posts..

This teacher went into her classroom about fifteen minutes before the class was supposed to begin and caught a bunch of boys in a huddle on their knees in the corner of the room. She demanded of them what they were doing, and one of them hollered back, "We're shooting craps."

She says, "Oh! Well, that's all right. I was afraid you were praying."

---

And I suppose I could just pretend to be blonde...

I have a "true" blond story for you. This really did happen... I went to dinner with my husband, a male friend of ours, Jim, and his new girlfriend, Dorthory.

While eating dinner we got on the subject of vacations. "Bimbette" (I really called her this for the rest of the time they were together and right to her face). Anyway, Bimbette said that she wanted to go to Gotham City for her next vacation.

I tried to explain to her that it was not a real place. She laughed and said, "It is too, it's where Batman lives."

I then laughed and looked over at Jim who smiled and told me she was serious. I then tried to explain that, "He does not exist, why do you think there have been three of them: Clooney, Kilmer and Keaton?"

She looked me straight in the eye and said, "That is because he doesn't want anyone to know who he really is."

---

"Ever wish history would wait longer to repeat itself?"

I know I do..

----

I think that the problem is that we just can't go back to pre-911 -

A crisis is when you can't say: "let's forget the whole thing".

---

And it really IS important who are friends are..

"A friend is someone who has the same enemies you have." (Abraham Lincoln)

---

And this one gives you pause for thought about the US, I think..

When everyone is against you, it means that you are absolutely wrong, or absolutely right.

----

Have a pleasant day, Darth.

Sara.

-- July 17, 2005 12:23 AM ∞

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Millionaire2B wrote:

SGT, Carl, Ziarian---I agree! : )

-- July 17, 2005 4:56 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

NEVER MADE
An indictment of christianity or Jesus. I did make an indictment of how man has interpreted their religion and what they think god wants. History is filled with tragic results and misdeeds performed under the banner of christianity. But that does not mean christianity needs to be eliminated. It is a wonderful faith and has made many wonderful contributions to mankind.
But just because lets say, a freewill baptist group decided to start bombing aborton clinics, or stem cell centers, I would not indict all christians groups, and place them in the same bag. Nor would I wholesale indict freewill baptist. I would place the indictment where it lays, with the one doing the atrocities. Christianity does not have a market on stupidity or misconceptions of what god wants.
To place all muslims in one bag, because of one radical sect within a reigious faith, is irresponsible and unfair. Years ago, here in America, we had the black panthers. As a young police officer, I never placed all black people in the same bag with the panthers, nor did I place all hippies in the same group as the weathermen, or all southern whites in the same bag with some members of the KKK.
The responsibility of attrocities lay with the ones committing the deeds, under the banner of of whatever their cause is, not with culture, faith, or any other group wholesale wise.
Observable Facts are just that.
Facts observed and interpreted as they are, not as we wish them to be.
Religious Faith plays a big part in the Islamic world. To say it will not have an affect on the Iragi Government is being naive. It will play a tremendious role in the valuation of the dinar in the years to come, and how the Iraqi people carry out business and interact with other world cultures.
When someone who is obviously a muslim starts giving you a interpretation of their concept of the koran, its verses, and how it relates to their culture, you should be wise enough to listen, and learn.
It doesn't mean giving up your concept of faith or even agreeing with them. But it does mean acceptance enough to be able to interact with their culture so the dinar can increase in value,. This mutuality to agree but disagree without disparging anothers view of each's culture, produces what the world wants. World trade and eventually a increase in the value of the dinar.

-- July 17, 2005 8:39 AM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

This gentleman on Capital Hill might seem to be a loose cannon and a little out in left field today..
But, I don't think the terrorists should assume this kind of thinking would not crop up if there was a nuclear attack on the United States. I think it would recur with a vengence. Note it 'drew praise' from some listeners.. more might be disposed to applaud that view after such an attack, mightn't they?
Sara.
---
Tancredo clarifies
'ultimate response'
Should U.S. bomb Islamic holy sites
after nuke terror attack on America?
Posted: July 15, 2005

Clarifying remarks from a radio interview that drew praise from some supporters, Rep. Tom Tancredo, R-Colo., said he was not suggesting that the U.S. should nuke the Islamic holy site Mecca as a response to a nuclear homeland attack by al-Qaida.

The congressman's press secretary told WorldNetDaily the comments were an off-the-cuff response to a hypothetical situation.

"He doesn't believe that we should go out and threaten to bomb anybody's holy city," said spokesman Will Adams.

The host asked Tancredo, "Worst case scenario, if they do have these nukes inside the border, what would our response be?"

The congressman replied: "There are things you could threaten to do before something like that happens, and then you have to do afterwards, that are quite draconian."

"Well," Tancredo continued, "what if you said something like, 'If this happens in the United States and we determine that it is the result of extremist, fundamentalist Muslims, you could take out their holy sites.'"

Campbell: "You're talking about bombing Mecca?"

Tancredo: "Yeah. What if you said, we recognize that this is the ultimate threat to the United States, therefore this is the ultimate response."

Adams said the remarks also need to be heard in the context of Tancredo's style.

"One of his vices and virtues is he is a free thinker and is willing to speak his mind," the spokesman said. "Sometimes he says things in not the most artful way; but if you take him as, unfortunately, one of the few free thinkers on Capitol Hill, you'll get where he is coming from."

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=45298

-- July 17, 2005 9:57 AM ∞

---

James wrote:

Ive been reading this site off and on for the last month or two because i also think there are millions to be made in the Dinar but im strarting to find more negative articles now than i did before like this one http://www.xe.com/iqd.htm What is the group consensus and when could we be expecting the dinar to peg? I'm currently in Iraq so ive been buying up a few here and there but the main place ive been getting mine is from my bank back home. Its Exchange bank in Milledgeville ,Georgia and the woman handaling the acct. is Linda Bell . All i had to do was start a savings acct. there. Thank you all for your time.

-- July 17, 2005 1:19 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

James;

Well, I think that Iraq is a country that does have a lot going for it. The people are well represented and all those who are running the government are able to work together and are peaceful. Their goals appear to me to be reasonable and attainable. If you could extract the terrorists from Iraq, the entire future in Iraq for the people, region and economy looks very assured and strong. They have oil, dates, agriculture and support in the region. I do respect them as a people and wish only the best for them and real peace in the region. I think a free, independent Iraq would do more to advance the religious Islamic cause than the terrorism we see today. As Ziarian said, Islam does spread in times of peace quite well.

As the PM of Iraq stated on his trip to the US, the terrorists are foreign elements in Iraq, not homegrown "insurgents". (Note that Z is not Iraqi, for instance.) The PM therefore said to please refer to them only as "terrorists" and never as "insurgents" since "insurgents" means they are working from a popular base within the country's populace, which he said they are not. Calling them "insurgents" is like referring to the terrorists of 9-11 as Americans only because they struck inside of America when they attacked the WTC. As Ziarian said, perhaps a little terror against the anti-societal elements is a kind of terror all Muslims should be engaged in. In this case, helping the duly elected Iraqi government which is in power in Iraq to depress the pretensions of these foreign terrorist elements who are being a terror to the law abiding men, women and children civilians in Iraq would be a good use of that advice.

You ask when it will peg.. well, I suggest you watch and see. :)
If you haven't already, you also might try this link, as it was interesting:
http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?p=77492#post77492

Sara.

-- July 17, 2005 2:21 PM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Is this fourm for the dinar or just a set of Religion freaks that has nothing better to do.

How come no one post about the dinar pegging,(or maybe is has already) hence the value is moving up and dowm.

Please stop all the long articles about Religion. No one religion is better than the next and anyone who belives that thier religion is better than the next person is a fool.

-- July 17, 2005 4:11 PM ∞

---

Lila Mcracken wrote:

Sara,

You post was certainly long, but I loved every word of it. Thanks.

Lila

-- July 17, 2005 4:58 PM ∞

---

JakeP wrote:

http://truckandbarter.com/mt/archives/000581.html#13395

Posts such as above are not about the dinar and should be ceased
Please everyone has the right to their religous
opinion etc
but this forum is not the place for such long
contrived religous posts

thank you
Jake

-- July 17, 2005 9:37 PM ∞

---

Investindinar wrote:

Hi All,

So what is going on here with the IQD? There was a lot of talk a few weeks ago about the 15th of July being the date of an increase...now I am hearing about the "week after the donors' conference in Jordan" or the 28th of July.

It seems to me that people just keeping throwing about random dates, and then when the date passes they throw out another random date.

What is the point of people doing this over and over again (because it seems to be a trend on this board)?

Also what is with all the religious talk on the board? I thought we were supposed to talk about the IQD only....not religion. I understand that religion plays a part in politics and economics, but I think when people start discussing nuking Mecca and debating which religion is right or wrong....we have taken it too far.

Anyway hope everyone is doing well and good luck to all,

Investindinar

-- July 18, 2005 5:02 AM ∞

---

jimmy p wrote:

To James in Iraq: Thanks for all that you do! I hope that you and your closest service mates NEVER feel that you are underappreciated! This great country of ours allows us to be engaged in newsworthy events, or not. I hope that deep down everyone that participates in this board feels a direct kinship with those of you in the Iraqi-Afganistan Theater that are bustin hump and takin care of business for the rest of us that keep our economy humming.

To reflect on your post from yesterday, I did re-read the commentary on xe.com and remember thinking, "Why has someone not reminded the folks that run the xe.com website that their commentary promoting caution is nearly a year old and older?"
The addition of the times commentary is new to me and I will have to study their background before I feel comfortable trying to understand their motives.
I also read the new link on iraqinvestors (thank you sara)before I issue my opinion for what it is worth...
Our capitalist society allows us to take care of ourselves by working our fingers to the bone if we so choose in order to provide a better life for ourselves and our loved ones. We then have the ability to recognize opportunities as they present themselves to us and either shy away or jump in with both feet.
We all want to better ourselves and our standings in life. And I Thank God, our Commander In Chief George W. Bush, and all our service men and women that volunteer their fannies to protect the rest of us!
I do believe that all of the Iraqi Dinar that we citizens can purchase, does have a soothing effect on the war effort, in that it should hasten the of bringing our troops home sooner.

-- July 18, 2005 6:02 AM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

INVESTINDINAR, excellent post. Therewillbeother dates by these so call gurs and others who say they are in iraq. In my opinion thhis is a dead goose. This dinar is toliet paper and the ones that are posting at merchants making money of others. I said it before, this is like a bulletin board stock (pump and dump).

No one here has any meat and patatoes of this dinar , that is why we hear all the stupid talk about religion.

And don't forget all thelong meaning less post, some people have a lot of time to pump this dinar.

-- July 18, 2005 9:13 AM ∞

---

outlaw in Iraq wrote:

Hi Gang....

I see that people are starting to question why dates are flying around and passing without anything happening...

Does anyone remember me saying about two weeks ago that "Even the people in charge don't know what's going on!" This is a very true statement... there are too many things that decide the opening date....not just a person!

As I said before... "kick off your shoes and sit a spell!" We all need to quit watching and waiting! Put your Dinar in a safe place and come back and check on what's going on about once every month or so. Trust me...when it opens...everyone will know! Driving your self crazy isn't going to make it happen any faster!

Outlaw

-- July 18, 2005 12:46 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Board;

For those not disposed to read any of my posts, religious or not, you may just skip them. But if I am asked, and addressed specifically, I will reply and give my opinion, whether that includes the religion question or not. If it is too long for you to read, you need not read it. No one is forcing you to. In case you didn't know, it is called free speech, and is a fundamental right here.

This post refers to Carl's post to me, to Iraq, the fortunes of the Middle East, and, yes, the religious question hanging over their economic fortunes (the Dinar).. and ours. (Do you really think a nuclear attack on our soil will NOT affect our economy? And - is it best to completely ignore that threat or any discussion of it on this board when it will affect both their money - the Dinar - AND OURS?).

Sara.

----
Carl;

Your point is well taken. You said:
"To place all muslims in one bag, because of one radical sect within a religious faith, is irresponsible and unfair."

You basically said, "Don't tar with the same brush all Christians OR Mulims.. or any other group." There are many saying that the terrorists are hijacking the religion of Islam for their own purposes. Ziarian identified himself as both fundamentalist and terrorist (after redefining those words). I am sure that there would be those who would redefine the word "Christian" (follower of Christ) when it was hijacked by those who tortured people on racks, burnt people at the stake, or did other atrocities, too (which is proof they did not follow Christ by their actions which deny Him).

I wish to have hope that there can be a peaceful solution. I wish for the Middle Eastern people, (and Iraq in particular) that they might live in tolerant and peaceful societies, peacefully coexisting with other people and religions within their countries and among the countries of the world.

The people of Iraq are creating a governing structure encorporating democracy - which has brought the most freedom to the largest amount of people in the world - while seeking to be faithful to and informed from their religious ideals inspired by Islam. Unlike the terrorists, they do not appear to be threatened by this freedom causing a potential loss of some people to other religious folds. Instead, they appear to be confident enough in the fundamental correctness of their religion to allow the giving of people the fundamental freedom to choose.

The Iraqi government's allowing the right, the freedom to choose - even wrongly - shows a greater degree of belief and confidence in the correctness of one's opinion than using sheer force to cause outward conformity to a religious ideal. True righteousness must come from within and be uncoerced. The purpose of raising children is to bring them to the point of responsible adulthood where they will choose lawful and beneficial behavior of their own free will. True religion must strive for nothing less.

I was pleased to read these positive points and commentary from USA Today recently (url below):

•A conference of 180 top Muslim religious leaders issued a statement last week forbidding that any Muslim be declared an apostate. Bin Laden has frequently done this to sanction the death of Muslims he believes are too lax in their faith.

•The Middle East's best known radical groups — Hamas, Hezbollah and Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood — denounced the bombings, signaling their opposition to spreading terrorist tactics to Europe. Meanwhile, in the Palestinian territories, cultural figures are speaking out against efforts to impose “Taliban-style” rule and deny cultural “beauty” in people's lives.

•Muslim communities in Britain have helped police with tips and information. British Muslim leaders said they were drafting a fatwa that would strip any bombers of the right to call themselves Muslims. “Nothing in Islam can ever justify the evil actions of the bombers,” the leader of the Muslim Council of Britain said. “We are determined to work to prevent such an atrocity ever happening again.”

•A new poll Thursday showed support for Osama bin Laden and terrorist bombings against Americans and their allies in Iraq falling in several heavily Muslim countries, particularly those where terrorist attacks have occurred. One example: In Lebanon, those who think violence is justified in defense of Islam fell from 73% three years ago to 39% now. The support is still sizeable, but the trend is in the right direction. The poll, part of the Pew Global Attitudes Project, was conducted before the attacks in London last week. Chances are, the bombings prompted further erosion.

All provide at least some hope that terrorism is hurting the radicals' cause among Muslims. Even so, the question raised by the London bombings — for governments as well as for Muslims — is not whether a majority can be won over. It is how a small but violent minority can be stopped.

Muslims are, for the most part, unhappy at many U.S. and British policies and actions in the Middle East. Those include the war in Iraq, where Muslims are being killed; support for repressive Arab regimes; and a sense the United States in particular is not doing enough to help the Palestinians.

Those are fair subjects for political debate, but that debate needs to be cleaved from the use of terrorism as a tool.

At the same time, western leaders need to guard against anti-Muslim backlash. In the wake of the attacks Sept. 11, 2001, President Bush visited a mosque and repeatedly emphasized his respect for Islam. Now, British Prime Minister Tony Blair is pushing for more dialogue and other efforts.

Back in 1993, Harvard professor Samuel Huntington controversially predicted a “clash of civilizations.” Religion, he said, was becoming “a basis for identity and commitment that transcends national boundaries and unites civilizations.” And that, in turn, was drawing lines of conflict, in particular between the Islamic world and the West.

More easily dismissed back then, it isn't now. What's needed is a battle within Islam, not against it.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20050715/edit15.art.htm

It is in this direction that there lies some hope that the conflict could be resolved peacefully.

OUR only deterrent has to be to threaten that which the radicals care about, thus the use of "ultimate" force, a solution we are loth to use. The deterrent from within the religion may be able to win with less radical means. One can hope their deterrents against those in their own ranks will work so we might never be forced to use ours. Something less than the use of "ultimate" force as a solution is always much preferrable. We would only be brought to that point of having to use "ultimate" force when those other solutions prove themselves failures in stopping the disaster of terrorist nuclear attack on our soil. "Ultimate" force, then, is our trump card, only to be played if there is no other solution, in the face of a WMD or nuclear attack.

I do maintain that it would be foolhardy for the terrorists to assume that cooler heads would prevail and that no one would feel the force of the argument to use this ultimate force - to retaliate against that which the radicals care about - if the US were attacked with WMD or nuclear bombs.

May it never become necessary..

Sara.

-- July 18, 2005 2:25 PM ∞

---

Terrance wrote:

What happened on this board over the weekend?Lots of tension and fireworks - that's cool though. I like it. Healthy debate and exchange of ideas is a good thing.

And what a great country we live in - just think of it - to be able to speak openly and freely about differing religous viewpoints without getting your head lopped off.

To the contrary - not only do we get to keep our heads, but we can hang out and eat pig together in friendship......

LLL (Live Life Large) and laugh a little bit - it will be good practice before we laugh our way all the way to the bank.....

T-

-- July 18, 2005 2:26 PM ∞

---

Abby wrote:

I am confused about the purpose of your site. I am a dinar investor and landed here thinking I might be able to find some useful information. Instead, your site is mostly just religious rhetoric with very little speculation/facts thrown in. If your purpose is to discuss religion, please make this clear so that people like myself do not end up wasting time here. Thanks.

-- July 18, 2005 2:57 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Lila;

Thank you for your kind words. You are always very gracious and I appreciate that. :)

Outlaw;

You said:
"kick off your shoes and sit a spell!" We all need to quit watching and waiting!

I agree with the kicking off your shoes and sitting a spell, but if you have a fishing rod in the pond, you do need to kinda watch the rod to see if anything is hooked on the end of it yet. I believe in waiting, but a little peeking at the rod once in a while might be worthwhile, too. So relax, soak up some sun, but keep a lazy eye on the fishing rod.. wouldn't want to lose it into the pond when a live one starts the rod moving.

Terrance;

I agree, it is nice to be able to express your opinion and not worry about your head being lopped off. Freedom is what the Armed Forces are preserving every day with what they are doing in Iraq and around the world. I agree, jimmy p, we should be thankful to "all our service men and women that volunteer their fannies to protect the rest of us".

Sara.

-- July 18, 2005 3:32 PM ∞

---

Mike wrote:

It's not a matter of one religion being "better" than another. It's a matter of "What is the truth?" Religions are not all the same, because they cannot all point to truth if they are saying different things. I know of only one person who proved he was from God.

There are many older posts detailing information and opinions about the NID. They should be very helpful.

-- July 18, 2005 4:08 PM ∞

---

meatgrinder wrote:

Hey religious freaks. Yeh you. Go to another blog if you want to talk about or should I say argue about religion. Truth is if I know of no God that promotes violence however in my opion if we have a chance to capture or kill any of these evil doers I say we do it in a mosk, chapel, temple or where ever the hell these nuts worship. Please keep this site open for talks about the dinar.

-- July 18, 2005 5:08 PM ∞

---

Sporter wrote:

Official: Iraq should lead reconstruction
SOUTHERN SHUNEH, Jordan (AP) — Iraq's planning minister said Monday his country should be in charge of reconstruction efforts instead of foreign donors, and he laid out a strategy aimed at improving life for Iraqis frustrated by security and political challenges.
"Iraq must be in the driving seat," Planning Minister Barham Salih said as representatives of 60 countries and international organizations gathered here to review Iraq's reconstruction checklist and coordinate with donors on ways to move forward.

"We need Iraqi leadership, we need Iraqi ownership of the reconstruction program and a partnership with the international community," he said, echoing criticism by some Iraqis that many projects were suggested by the U.S.-backed Interim Governing Council members, many of whom had not been in the country for years.

The vast majority of projects in Iraq went to U.S. and Western companies.

Salih stressed that priority must be given to projects which yield the "most benefit to the greatest number of (Iraqis) in the shortest time possible."

He announced a national development strategy that includes strengthening the foundations of economic growth, revitalizing the private sector, strengthening good governance, and improving security conditions.

Salih said power, water and sanitation needed to be immediately restored.

He said Iraqis needed "quick wins," like housing, loans and education grants.

"The aspirations of the Iraqi people for a better life cannot be delayed much longer," he said.

Participants later met behind closed doors to continue the discussions.

The two-day meeting which opened Monday is sponsored by the International Reconstruction Fund Facility for Iraq. The fund was launched in 2004 by the United Nations and the World Bank to help donor nations channel their resources and coordinate their support for reconstruction and development.

So far, 25 donor countries — including the United States, Japan and Canada — have pledged more than $1 billion. The money is separate from the $32 billion in loans and grants pledged for Iraq's reconstruction at the 2003 donor conference in Spain.

Salih criticized the shortfall in donations. Of the total pledged two years ago, he said Iraq has received only $7 billion. The bulk of it, he insisted, was spent on improving security conditions for foreign firms in the country.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2005-07-18-iraq-rebuild_x.htm

-- July 18, 2005 5:21 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

World Bank lends Iraq $500 million for rebuilding

July 18, 2005

Jordan

The World Bank has extended a $500 million soft loan to Iraq for rebuilding, World Bank officials said.

The loan with a grace period of over 10 years is the first by the bank to Iraq since 1973, the officials said.

http://www.iraqdirectory.com/files/articles/article591.htm

-- July 18, 2005 5:53 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Hitting every target...

----

‘Iraq on track for elections despite rise in violence’
(AFP) 18 July 2005

BERLIN - US Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman General Richard Myers said on Monday he expected bloodshed to increase in Iraq but that the country would remain on course for elections this year.

“Every major milestone that has been set by Iraqi people and with the help of the coalition, with the help of the United Nations and now with the help of NATO...has been met,” Myers told reporters in Berlin.

“That will continue, in my belief, to happen. We should see a draft constitution by the end of this month. A constitutional referendum is planned for the middle of October and then (national) elections in December. I think the situation -- security, political, economic -- will allow that to happen.”

More than 126 people were killed in three days of attacks in Iraq, including 83 who lost their lives when a suicide bomber blew up a fuel tanker Saturday near a Shiite mosque.

Myers said that such attacks were “difficult to explain” but insisted that the country was stabilizing and better off than under Saddam Hussein.

“Clearly, there is going to be more violence ahead because there are people who don’t want this kind of progress to happen,” he said.

“The interesting thing is they do not have an alternative plan for what should happen other than go back to a regime that was even more threatening to its people than what we saw the last couple of days.”

http://www.khaleejtimes.com/DisplayArticle.asp?xfile=data/focusoniraq/2005/July/focusoniraq_July96.xml§ion=focusoniraq

-- July 18, 2005 6:07 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Abby;

At the top of the page it says:
"As of June 22, 2005 this is the new post discussing the Iraqi Dinar."

The purpose of the Board is to discuss the Iraqi Dinar and everything that affects or effects its value.

As you know, the terrorists in Iraq are the main obstacle to the stabilization of the economy and things moving forward for the Dinar's value. The terrorists are also a very religious group, and justify their destabilization of Iraq by their religious beliefs. That is why, of late, there has been some discussion on the religious factors in Islamic terrorist thinking.

Actually, one fellow posted he was a terrorist and thinks all Muslims should be one. On the face of it, an objectionable statement, and one which caused quite lively discussion. But the end result of all the discussion on this particular topic has been to see what this mode of thinking is, and how it affects Iraq and our investment. Terrorism has a lot to do with the Dinar's fortunes..

But perhaps you wish to examine other factors, such as the Iraqi Central Bank policies, the pace of reconstruction, or the possible entry into the GCC of Iraq.. whatever the aspect you wish to explore in this very large field of speculating on the Dinar and trying to understand what factors will make up the valuation of the Dinar, you will probably find some reference to it on one of T&B's pages.

At the top of the page, there are references to other pages of discussion. If this topic of terrorism (and religion's role in terrorism) of late seems not to your taste, try reading a different discussion from previous postings. There are lots of factors to choose from, and no one knows how the different factors will go together to form the final product (which is an increase in the worth of the Iraqi Dinar).

This forum is for DISCUSSING the Dinar, and we are just DISCUSSING our various theories and the various factors affecting the Dinar. Each person contributes as we go along what they think might affect the final result. YOU, Abby, are welcome to contribute your own ideas, and what you have learned or think worth posting, if you have anything to say on the topic. Most on the board appreciate when a member is contributing and won't jump down your throat for asking a silly question or contributing a comment they dislike. But some might, so you should, perhaps, read a little of the past discussions before trying to post yourself. :)

I would also recommend investorsiraq.com, where the topics are single, and you can read on all one factor at a time. But their information is often different and, perhaps, less thorough than this board, and the posts quoted from that forum have often been shown to be untrue, so I must warn you to check whatever you read carefully.

Sara.

-- July 18, 2005 6:23 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Mike;

What a wonderful conviction it is you have. :)
You said: "I know of only one person who proved he was from God."

My thought, in the post earlier today was, let's just let the people decide, uncoerced, what they wish to believe as far as their religious convictions go. Perhaps, if they are given the freedom to believe as they wish to believe, they will believe Jesus proved he was from God. Perhaps they will maintain that the person from God was Mohammed, or Buddah, or no one. But at least they will be strong in their belief and it will be a free choice, and they will allow others the same freedom to choose that they have.

Freedom of religion need not threaten those who are sincerely holding to what they believe to be the Truth. Truth need fear nothing, for every religion in some way teaches that Truth will win the battle in the end. All we ask is that Truth be allowed to speak, and people be allowed to choose which THEY think is Truth according to the dictates of their own conscience. No one should be forced to believe, or not believe.

As for johnnyhavedinar, he said:

"No one religion is better than the next and anyone who belives that thier religion is better than the next person is a fool."

He believes that we are all fools for even thinking any religion or god is Truth. That is the Truth he believes, a choice to NOT believe in ANY god or religion as True above another. Meatgrinder, another poster, would probably second this view since he calls all religious people freaks and nuts. Surely to protect the right to believe freely what we sincerely think is true, we must allow all beliefs, even UNbelief, as a choice of man's free will. Anything less is tyranny and dictatorship.

For the good of the Iraqi people, and the prosperity of the Iraqi economy, I sincerely hope they will establish a free, democratic Iraq where people of all faiths can live in tolerance of other people's religious opinions and not kill each other over who believes what about certain verses in their Holy Books.

Meatgrinder said, "I know of no God that promotes violence"...

If he could just manage to get that across to those daily blowing people up in Iraq, we might have a better valuation on our investment. :) Having a free choice in what you believe and being able to live in peace without people killing you for not believing their way.. would be very nice for the Iraqi people, and good for the fortunes of our Dinar investment.

Sara.

-- July 18, 2005 7:10 PM ∞

---

Jimmy P wrote:

Hungry For New Info? Click On This:
http:www.zaman.com/?bl=hotnews&alt=&trh=20050712&hn=21674

Yes, we all are hungry for new info. I for one can see that many posts here serve to fill the time gap between helpful and substantive data we use to justify our positions. They are all useful.

I am sorry if some feel offended that some posts require "too much" reading and not enough "Meat and Potatoes". I just hope that when they start their own weblog that caters to their personal preferences that they let this board know where to find it. Wink Wink.

-- July 19, 2005 4:14 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Johnnyhavedinar
Just read your post on calling people fools.
Thank you for posting that. That made me stop during my busy day, and think of my grandfather.
It brought a smile to my face, as I remembered a small statured, soft spoken man who was the perfect image of a Southern gentleman with silky silver hair, that was always neatly combed.
Ya Know! As the years have gone by, I have found that a lot of my grandfather's sayings came from experience, and wisdom gained during his 81 years.
Some of those sayings were;
Carl, Always remember this, because one day it is going to come in handy.
You! can't ride two horses with one ass!
Meaning having a girlfriend and wife at the same time,or trying to fulfill two obligations at the same time, at different ends of the stick are extremely difficult, if not impossible to do well.

Another of his sayings made me think of you.

A man who calls another a fool without knowing anything about the other man, usually doesn't have to walk further than the mirror to see another fool.

Carl

-- July 19, 2005 7:42 AM ∞

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Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Hey! Meatgrinder! or whatever your real name is!
It is amazing at the ones who act and bellow like they have nuts of a bull, but in reality look like a chipmunk sprawled on his back. Yep! sorry! saw ya sunbathing...
Got a little news for ya!
We have got people on this board who have one month growth of whiskers older than you are on this board.. so just like my granddaddy use to tell me when I was a young snotty nose kid with very little walking around sense.( I sort of put you in that category, sorry! if the shoe fits)
"If you don't have anything to say thats constructive, then sat in your chair, eat your cornflakes and shut the hell up until you do." Don't like the board...then don't let the door hit in the ass on the way out.

-- July 19, 2005 8:18 AM ∞

---

SGT at SPOD wrote:

Carl;

Your post reminded me of two sayings that my Grandfather used to say;

"If you are willing to make a ass out of yourself, there will always be someone to ride you".
and...........

"A wise man can learn more from a foolish question, than a fool can from a wise answer".

Hang in there Brother,

SGT at SPOD

-- July 19, 2005 8:57 AM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

I almost fallof my chair and died and i lost so much sleep over your wonderful messagefrom your grand dad. God bless his soul, what a wise man.

I also see that my dear friend SGt is back I was hoping we can meet here in the triangle and have some persian tea.

It isfriend like you all thatmake this board so intresting.

We are all hanging in there brothers and sister .

-- July 19, 2005 11:43 AM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

hello Carl on wilson lake ,

You Asked
"How many forms of Islamic beliefs are there? Is that faith just as diverse as the christian faith? What form of Islam or view of Islam do the Insurgents practice? It is obviously not a very popular view, or the entire Muslim society would embrace it, and we would be fighting all muslims, not just a small percentage.
How many sects or views of Islam are there?
I bring these questions, up only because certain radical groups use the Islam faith as their banner in the battle for Iraq. These battles have a direct affect on the valuation of the dinar".

when u ask " what form of islam or view of islam do the insurgents practice. "

it means u want to judge islam. Now if I agree for the sake of argument that the Muslims are bad, we can’t judge Islam by its followers? If you want to judge how good Islam is then judge it according to its authentic sources, i.e. the Glorious Qur’an and the Sahih Hadith.

For example:
If you want to judge how good is the latest model of the "Mercedes" car and a person who does not know how to drive sits at the steering wheel and bangs up the car, who will you blame? The car or the driver? But naturally, the driver. To analyze how good the car is, a person should not look at the driver but see the ability and features of the car. How fast is it, what is its average fuel consumption, what are the safety measures, etc

* Judge Islam by its best follower i.e. Prophet Mohammed (pbuh):

If you practically want to check how good a car is put an expert driver behind the steering wheel. Similarly the best and the most exemplary follower of Islam by whom you can check how good Islam is, is the last and final messenger of God, Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Besides Muslims, there are several honest and unbiased non-Muslim historians who have acclaimed that prophet Muhammad was the best human being. According to Michael H. Hart who wrote the book, ‘The Hundred Most Influential Men in History’, the topmost position, i.e. the number one position goes to the beloved prophet of Islam, Muhammad (pbuh). There are several such examples of non-Muslims paying great tributes to the prophet, like Thomas Carlyle, La-Martine, etc.

Now it is Proved that if the people of any religion are bad, then we can not judge religion by its Followers.

-- July 19, 2005 1:11 PM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

Hi Sara,

" Religous Intolerance....

Ziarian;

In your first post you said:
"It says that there was a peace treaty between the Muslims and the Mushriqs (pagans) of Makkah. This treaty was violated by the Mushriqs of Makkah."

Yet note that the Koran says to the Muslims, as previously quoted:

"If you fear treachery from any of your allies, you may fairly retaliate by breaking off your treaty with them." (Surah 8:51-)

In context.. WHY did these supposed 'pagans'..... "

i have a reason to post Question&Answer on this Fourm, which is that some people in this fourm told lie or misqouted some verses of Quran . I posted answer just for information but SARA if u need more discussion on that topic we can join together in another place of ur choice i will be glad to discuss With You.
Thanks
Ziarian

-- July 19, 2005 1:48 PM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Ziarian:
It is obvious you are muslim. I think if you wanted the opportunity to explain how muslims feel about what is happening in Iraq or the Islamic faith, this is the board to do it on. I know I for one am interested in getting the muslims view of what is happening in Iraq and what you think the outcome will be.
The concept of the driver and car is interesting. Let me ask you something. What if the driver has every intention of not hurting anyone with the car, however, while he is driving it, he reads some driver instructions that says if he observes a certain species of animal in the road, the driver is to run over the animal and kill it. Should the driver follow the car's operator manual or make a common sense judgement as whether that is the right or wrong thing to do toward destroying the animal?
I have found in christianity, there are many colors and types of cars. The drivers well, that is another category within itself.
I know the Shia and Sunni sects have different interpretations of their faith. Some more moderate, and some for fundamentalistic. Otherwords, you have different controls for a mercedes than a volkswagon, and the driver operates within the guidelines, that it takes to steer each particular car.
Each cleric teaches differently, some more moderate than others. In Christianity, there is the bible, but some have been written with different interpretations. Does the Koran have different versions out there for their followers, same as the bible?
I am not all that familiar with the middle eastern cultures or the Islamic faith. Therefore, some of the questions, I may ask will be basic to you, but will be uncharted territory for me.
Communication is 70% visual and 30% audible. Since we both are at a disavantage of visual, I will do my best to phrase my questions as clearly as possible. I may not always meet that standard but will try. If my questions tend to offend, tell me and I will adjust the question. The purpose of this dialog is to learn from each other here,not to make judgement on your faith or any other. The questions, I would like to cover, will span over the Islamic faith, simply because it will and his playing a significant part in the new Iraq. I will also have questions, on how what you think the consitution should include, and why. If you are game, then we can continue. If not say so, and these questions will stop.
The purpose of the following questions is to just to get a idea of your background.
Do you live here in america or outside of it?
So I can understand how you interpret the Koran, are you from Iraq,in Iraq, or other areas.
Are you a citizen of America or born in another country.

It is obvious you can read and write english. In that field, you are ahead of me, as I cannot read or write arabic.Were you schooled in america or elsewhere?

From your concept of the insurgency fighting in Iraq, what do you think they want to accomplish, besides kicking our butts out of there.

Given there are different groups within the insurgency, do you think most of them were members of Saddams militia, or are they being supplied from other countries? Why would the surrounding countries want to keep things disrupted and stall the economic growth of Iraq?

How do you think most muslims view the insurgency and the mass deaths they cause with the bombs?

I think that is enough questions for now.

-- July 19, 2005 2:11 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

This is quite a good thread:

http://www.investorsiraq.com/showthread.php?p=78705

It is about Iraq and the IMF..
and the PEG!!! :)

Among other things, it quotes an IMF document saying:

"Iraq has been granted observer status in the World Trade Organization."

Interesting speculation on that thread. :)

Sara.

-- July 19, 2005 2:27 PM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

Hi Sara,

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/07/06/pakistan.rape.reut/index.html

"Perhaps these hundreds of women who are raped and killed every year in this progressive MUSLIM nation are a taste of what you mean by "every Muslim should be a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society"? These Muslim men certainly felt it was an honorable thing to do. Where did they get that idea from? How can you condemn their actions when you advocate, not the rule of law, but "EVERY Muslim" being "a terrorist for the antisocial elements of society"?....... "

if i say that (it is not my words but are the facts)

" U.S.A. has one of the highest rate of Rape

The United States of America is supposed to be one of the most advanced countries of the world. An F.B.I report in the year 1990 says that 1,02,555 cases of rape were reported. It further says that only 16% of the cases of rapes are reported. Thus, in order to know the actual number of rapes that took place in 1990, the reported figure should be multiplied by 6.25. We get a total of 6,40,968 rape cases that took place in the year 1990. If the total is divided by 365 the number of days in a year, we get an average of 1,756 rape incidents everyday.

Later another report said that an average of 1900 cases of rape are committed in U.S.A every day. According to National Crime Victimization Survey Bureau of Justice Statistics (U. S. Dept. of Justice) in 1996 alone 3,07,000 cases of rape were reported. Only 31% of the actual cases of rape were reported. Thus, 3,07,000 X 3.226 = 9,90,322 rapes took place in 1996. That is, an average of 2,713 cases of rape took place everyday in America in 1996. Every 32 seconds one rape is taking place in America. Maybe American rapists got bolder. The FBI report of 1990 continues and says that out of the rape cases that were reported only 10% of the rapist were arrested, that is only 1.6% of the actual rapes committed. Out of those arrested, 50% were let free before the trial. This would mean that only 0.8% of the rapists faced a trial. In other words if a person commits 125 rapes the chances that he will get a punishment for rape is only once. Many would consider this a good gamble. And the report says that of those people who faced trial 50% received sentences of less than a year’s imprisonment though the American law says rape carries a seven year sentence of imprisonment. For a rapist, the judge is lenient to first time offenders. Imagine a person commits 125 rapes and the chances of being convicted is only once, and 50% of the time the judge will grant leniency and give a sentence of less than a year! "

then what will be ur comments. actually if I agree for the sake of argument that the Muslims are bad, we can’t judge Islam by its followers? If you want to judge how good Islam is then judge it according to its authentic sources, i.e. the Glorious Qur’an and the Sahih Hadith.

For example:
If you want to judge how good is the latest model of the "Mercedes" car and a person who does not know how to drive sits at the steering wheel and bangs up the car, who will you blame? The car or the driver? But naturally, the driver. To analyze how good the car is, a person should not look at the driver but see the ability and features of the car. How fast is it, what is its average fuel consumption, what are the safety measures, etc

* Judge Islam by its best follower i.e. Prophet Mohammed (pbuh):

If you practically want to check how good a car is put an expert driver behind the steering wheel. Similarly the best and the most exemplary follower of Islam by whom you can check how good Islam is, is the last and final messenger of God, Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Besides Muslims, there are several honest and unbiased non-Muslim historians who have acclaimed that prophet Muhammad was the best human being. According to Michael H. Hart who wrote the book, ‘The Hundred Most Influential Men in History’, the topmost position, i.e. the number one position goes to the beloved prophet of Islam, Muhammad (pbuh). There are several such examples of non-Muslims paying great tributes to the prophet, like Thomas Carlyle, La-Martine, etc.

u need positive view about islam if people do something bad never blame on the religion.for more discussion i hav offered u a solution describe in my last comments :)

Thanks
ziarian

-- July 19, 2005 2:44 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Ziarian;

Thank you for posting.
It was well said, Ziarian.

"Now it is Proved that if the people of any religion are bad, then we can not judge religion by its Followers."

You also said in the second post:

"... some people in this fourm told lie or misqouted some verses of Quran . I posted answer just for information."

As Carl said, I say so, too:

"I think if you wanted the opportunity to explain how muslims feel about what is happening in Iraq or the Islamic faith, this is the board to do it on. I know I for one am interested in getting the muslims view.."

I am sorry if some on the board have in the past made it seem that your comments are not welcome. I certainly would like to listen and learn from the wisdom you have. Only by understanding the Muslim viewpoint will we be able to move forward. The goal of the board is supposed to be dialog and discussion on Iraq and the Dinar, and your Muslim viewpoint on the situation in Iraq, with the insights you are able to share with us, could so very much help us to understand some of the most key factors involved in both.

We understand that you, like those of Muslims in the Middle East, have a faith which is integral to who and what you are; and that that faith is also integral to those who are fighting in Iraq. I was reading about a Muslim man in Iraq who was responsible for diffusing the bombs on that suicide bomber they took into custody recently. I was trying to understand what motivated him, as a religious Muslim man of faith. It was interesting to me to hear what this man says before diffusing a terrorist bomb.
From the USA today article:

BAGHDAD — Haqy Asaad scanned the twirl of wires running from the bleeding man's chest and saw what he was looking for: wires tucked into a pants pocket.

The man, twitching in the back of a pickup, had about 5 pounds of explosives stuffed into a homemade flak jacket, with wires jutting out in different directions.

Asaad, 38, a member of the Iraqi Explosives Ordnance Detachment, mouthed the same prayer he always recites at bomb sites: There is no God but Allah, and Mohammed is the messenger of Allah.

The man moved his left hand, searching for the detonator, Asaad said. Still mouthing his prayer, Asaad cut the wires, confident that he had disarmed the bomb. He pulled the vest off the man and took a seat in the truck's cab.

A crowd of bystanders who were watching the drama Thursday morning from a safe distance erupted in applause.

“This guy saved the day,” said Conway, the Army spokeswoman, who watched from behind a Bradley Fighting Vehicle.

The would-be bomber was brought to a hospital.

Asaad stays busy. Suicide bombs are a regular occurrence now in the capital. Ten hours after disarming the suicide bomber, he was dispatched to eastern Baghdad, where a bomb had been discovered inside a shop. He disarmed the device.

“I'm Iraqi,” Asaad said as his cellphone jingled with another call from headquarters. “I can't just leave these bombs in all these neighborhoods. I want to live in a peaceful Iraq someday.”

----

It is that dream, of a peaceful Iraq - that is what we all are hoping and praying for. How do we obtain that dream? I think you may have some keys which could help us to unlock our understanding, if you would but help us. I hope the board will have enough tolerance to let us discuss the question - even its religious aspects - since such enlightenment appears to me to be integral to the fortunes of Iraq and the currency of Iraq (The Dinar). It could also affect our own Western economies.

I would very much enjoy a continuation of the discussion, and if you would be so kind, the answers to the questions Carl has posted. If the discussion gets too much attack, we can take it off board and discuss it between ourselves (my email address is saraand@fastmail.fm) but I do hope that we might stay on the board for our discussion, as so many others have wisdom to contribute which I would dearly like to hear, too. :) (Leo32, could you give us a word or two to contribute to our understanding of the Muslim viewpoints too, for instance?)

Trying for discussion, dialog, tolerance and understanding..

Sara.

-- July 19, 2005 3:27 PM ∞

---

meatgrinder wrote:

Carl

You really got me there fella. Do you have anything to contribute to the dinar conversation or are you just really bored??????????? dick

-- July 19, 2005 3:27 PM ∞

---

Mike wrote:

Sara,

You said:
"For the good of the Iraqi people, and the prosperity of the Iraqi economy, I sincerely hope they will establish a free, democratic Iraq where people of all faiths can live in tolerance of other people's religious opinions and not kill each other over who believes what about certain verses in their Holy Books."

So do I, Sara. So do I.

-- July 19, 2005 3:57 PM ∞

---

Aaron wrote:

They are determined!!!

The international community has pledged billions of dollars to help rebuild Iraq but only a small amount of that has actually been spent.

Concerns about the sustainability of the post-Saddam Hussein political system, violence and widespread corruption have led donors to be cautious about implementing their pledges.

"Unless we move fast and effectively in the next few months we will have very serious problems on our hands," Planning Minister Barham Salih told Reuters.

"Failure is not an option because it will have dire consequences for the Iraqi people and for the region and for world security."

-- July 19, 2005 4:05 PM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Meatgrinder:

Bored!!!!! not at all...just tired of your arrogant disrepect to other board members. Thought I would give ya a little taste of your own medicine.

but it does give ya the warm and fuzzies when we have a mutual understanding of each other ..
doesn't It?

-- July 19, 2005 6:35 PM ∞

---

newbie wrote:

Do you think that the article on mebanknotes.com
is valid about the dinar being recalled in two years and new currency printed?

http://mebanknotes.com/iraqidinar/recall.html

Thanks

If it is, do we need to hurry and open an account in Iraq to protect our investment?

-- July 19, 2005 10:28 PM ∞

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hopeful$ wrote:

I vote we get a new page so we don't have to spend a great deal of time scrolling to the bottom.

Thanks

-- July 19, 2005 11:39 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

I vote we start another subject with out religon.

How is my dear friends Carl and Sgt. I miss you all so much. How about some persian tea.

-- July 20, 2005 1:31 AM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

JHD,

As to your baiting comments, C'mon,"Cheif"....I refuse to have a "Battle of the Minds" with an unarmed person.I come on this site for the free exchange of information. I dont try to make others conform to what I want to see, I think this can be a forum for the free exchange of thoughts and ideas(I leave it to the author to explain how it fits with the subject).

Kudos to Sara, Outlaw, Carl, and all the rest who are trying to express their opinion.

Cheif & Meatgrinder; sometimes its better to remain silent and have the world suspect you're an idiot, than to open your mouth and prove it.

SGT at SPOD

-- July 20, 2005 9:09 AM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

I just got promoted to SSGT , but i will take chief too.
But i am always looking for to hear your aspect of things on the ground over hear.

Why does it take some of us only 6 years to make SSGT.

Change MOS my friend

-- July 20, 2005 9:42 AM ∞

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meatgrinder wrote:

I am sorry you guys but is this or is this not a board for the Iraqi dinar. You tell me. I am confused..............

PS I love you Carl! Will you send me a picture?

-- July 20, 2005 10:21 AM ∞

---

Carl on Wilson Lake wrote:

Meatgrinder:
This is a board that covers a lot of subjects. However, somehow the board gradually became the place to come to and give information on the dinar.
You will find that here. But you will also find the board will include many things that affect the dinar. Religion is one of those influences. Especially in Iraq.
I agree that to discuss faith in general, this board is not the place for it.
Post regarding religious faith should only be covered if it relates to the dinar or what is going on in the the middle east.
I do not consider myself religous but I am a spiritual person. There is a big difference.

If you stay on the board long enough, you will find there are many different types of personalities represented. Some more passionate than others about religion and their faith.

The older members of the board have learned this, and realize that his just how a member thinks or communicates. The main rule is be respectful to all who post.
Name calling or make desparging remarks toward another, will get some rocks flying your way. If someone is disrepectful, then they it becomes open season on the them.
I responded to you and Johnnyhavedinar, disrespectfully simply because you both were disrespectful in your post to some members, and I wanted you to get some of your own medicine.
I believe the universe says whatever you put out, you usually get back.
No more rocks will be thrown from my corner, unless I see the incoming stones.

-- July 20, 2005 11:11 AM ∞

---

Jimmy P wrote:

Ziarian,
A technical question if I might ask.
Please relay your thoughts on why we in America have yet to see any prominent Muslim figures approach the media to speak out against the militant extremists that seem to have hi-jacked the Muslim religion for purposes other than peace and harmony?

Thank you.

-- July 20, 2005 12:51 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Rape Statistics...

Ziarian;

I find myself at a disadvantage, since I cannot actually ascertain your motives for quoting those rape statistics. The US population is very much larger than little Pakistan, and percentage wise those stastics may be no different than Pakistan's actual rape statistic. I do doubt that the "honor" culture they have makes it as easy to report such crimes as it is over here. (Covering up the crime when a woman has been abducted, raped by 8 men and tortured was not possible in the example quoted, nor are honor killings hideable. But with the culture of "honor" being so highly prized over there, few women would damage a man's reputation knowing what the retaliation might be for her reporting him.)

Therefore, if the purpose was to say that these statistics prove that the US has more of this kind of criminal behavior (such as the quote of one rape every 32 seconds), I am unsure that those statistics prove that categorically beyond a doubt. And though no crime is justifiable, you might note that the vast majority of the 'rapes' which went into those statistics you quoted are so-called 'date rapes' where it is difficult to prove that the line was crossed from consensual promiscuity into rape.

The Western courts define rape as being when a woman says "no" at any point in the process of sex (even within marriage), which can be physiologically difficult on the men involved in what they originally took to be consensual intercourse. Western culture has broken "free" of its Biblical roots and is rapidly embracing almost every facet of the view that "consensual sex" is not a crime or sinful. Divorced from their religious definitions (where the rightness or wrongness of such actions originated), sex related questions, including "what is rape" become subject to a quagmire of opinion into which more and more actions fall (how do you determine when consent has been given in the situation or not?). It is also useless to point out that if a Biblical code of morality were followed, the situation would not have occurred, of course.

The reason I brought up "honor rapes" (and killings) was because those crimes do indeed have something to do with the religious viewpoint the perpetrators hold. My concern was that SOME in Islam do appear to justify such behavior on religious grounds. In relating it to our concern about Iraq, we all know there will be a strong influence from the Koran tied into the new Iraqi constitution, and those laws will affect the daily lives of the Iraqi citizens. The questions which come to mind which I am hoping you can answer for us are ones like these - How do you think the new government will view this question of honor rape? Do you think there will be a conflict between what the Koran says, and what the new constitution will allow? Where do you think the conflict will be? Presently, does the Koran place blame for rape on the man, woman or both? Where do you think the constitution will place the blame?

When you say:
"... if I agree for the sake of argument that the Muslims are bad,"

It is not a question of arguing that all Muslims are bad. There are many good Muslims, no doubt. And many Muslims who would never do this behavior or think it correct in others to do so. What we are aiming at here is understanding the religious viewpoint concerning those who do believe these to be acts of "honor" and how it will affect a free democratic Iraq, its people, its culture and its currency. Without understanding that, we can go no further. I hope you can give the board some enlightenment on these points.

Respectfully,

Sara.

-- July 20, 2005 1:40 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

MP: Iraq has massive oil reserves in western governorates
Wednesday, July 20, 2005

(MENAFN) A Kuwaiti MP has stated that Iraq yields huge oil reserves in western governorates, hidden by the former regime for sectarian reasons, KUNA reported. In a statement to Kuwait News Agency (KUNA), he explained that he has extensive proofs that substantial natural resources, including western oil fields, were hidden by the former Iraqi regime. The wells, he added, were hidden after being dug by the former regime to support its false claims that western areas are poor due to lack of natural resources. At present, Iraq relies on oil wells in its south and north for 95 percent of its oil products needs.

http://www.tbiraq.com/menafn_news_bl.asp?inc_name=news_details&n_id=100976

-- July 20, 2005 1:53 PM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

Carl on Wilson lake ,

thanks for Reply. ur comments on concept of car and driving is also very intresting and have many deep facts.now let me give u a answer of ur question:

"What if the driver has every intention of not hurting anyone with the car, however, while he is driving it, he reads some driver instructions that says if he observes a certain species of animal in the road, the driver is to run over the animal and kill it. Should the driver follow the car's operator manual or make a common sense judgement as whether that is the right or wrong thing to do toward destroying the animal?"

offcourse it is wrong thing to do toward destroying the animal. in the view of islam everyone have their rights animals are also including in the list and also the trees of a garden. quran told us that in a holy war if the leaf of tree or whole tree would be damage it is not Jihad. now it is clear u know what is happening in Iraq innocent childrens died in bombing and now u can judge clearly what is the real viewpoint of Islam about Iraq's Jihad .

and u aslo reply that :

"I know the Shia and Sunni sects have different interpretations of their faith. Some more moderate, and some for fundamentalistic. Otherwords, you have different controls for a mercedes than a volkswagon, and the driver operates within the guidelines, that it takes to steer each particular car.
Each cleric teaches differently, some more moderate than others. In Christianity, there is the bible, but some have been written with different interpretations. Does the Koran have different versions out there for their followers, same as the bible? "

u wrote shia and sunni have difference interpretations of their faith. but we All muslims have Same Quran. Now Real Muslim only Follow the Quran not shiaism or sunnism . the words shia and sunni are used only for their identity.now it is also cleared .

the constitution of iraq should cover the needs of Iraq. now u know the problems of iraq. iraqi people needs their rights and constitution must have such a reforms which can help the people of iraq .
I m honorable citizen of Pakistan and Doing Study here. i do not have such a proficiency in english thats why i m writing answers in short paragraphs i have much info's but could not share due to weak English . :)

then u asked

" From your concept of the insurgency fighting in Iraq, what do you think they want to accomplish, besides kicking our butts out of there. "

if u are american u know the war in afghanistan in 1977 against USSR. now russia will never be silent at this point. i think russia will use muslims and want to broke USA. USA warns russia in tajikstan tradegy. everything is going behind the Insurgency in Iraq . the most groups of iraqi insurgency have same plan they want to pull out americans from Iraq it is not possible without help of other countries who are supporting them. every country have their own intrest in Iraq .
u asked :

" How do you think most muslims view the insurgency and the mass deaths they cause with the bombs? "

the Muslims have same view as Holy Quran told us. i have written the comments above.
Now i think sara will also be satisfied

thanks
Ziarian

-- July 20, 2005 2:23 PM ∞

---

john wrote:

Well I am convinced now that this site is no longer even worth reading when it comes to DINAR.

To many holly roller and "self proclaimed profits of scripture"

I read about people who are in Military service. Some I believe, with goat locker dreams and SSGT wishes. I love my Navy job but this is the last place to be talking about it.

Those of you who have DESTROYED this blog! You know who you are.

Talk about DINAR not DEVINE INTERVENTION or the price of eggs.

You have done nothing but made this blog about the DINAR another wasteland of worthless “CUT and PASTE”, “PLAGIARIZED”, and mix matched stories put together to make you Appear to be something your not.

Have fun and keep trying, your almost there, almost as pathetic as it gets with your over inflated self-image and intellect.

John

Dream big all.

-- July 20, 2005 2:42 PM ∞

---

Anonymous wrote:

Sara :
the Purpose of the statistics of rape is to show that the black sheeps are everywhere in the world in muslim society and also in westren society.

Thanks
Ziarian

-- July 20, 2005 4:07 PM ∞

---

Bill1 wrote:

Sara,

Thanks for your post regarding Mr. Haqy Asaad, the Bomb Diffuser in Iraq.

Now, here's a very brave gentleman, as are all of the military and para-military personnel on the J-O-B in Iraq.

Not knowing him from Adam, I find his brief story to be a brave and partriotic one. Not unlike the stories of our beloved and selfless Firefighters and Police Officers here in the U.S.

He does what he does not for himself, but for his fellow compatriots, and the most innocent of Iraq - The Children.

I'd give all of my Dinar, and any profit thereof (who cares about the money - big deal) to see Iraq become the Phoenix that rises from the ashes we all believe it will one day be. So, that the children and their families can smile and laugh again, and not have to get up every morning not knowing if they'll make it home that evening.

And, so that good people like Mr. Asaad can find other means of employment - much safer ones - and live to be a ripe old age himself.

You requested of Ziarian, and Leo32, that they open a dialog here on this site for those of us knowing very liitle of the Muslim Faith, to try and help us begin to understand better the Iraqi, Arab, and Muslim points of view.

I think that's a very good idear. This Blog has covered everything else under sun except that; and it is certainly one of - if not "The Most" - important influence underscoring the future of Iraq.

I hope you gentlemen will heed Sara's request.

Here's to Mr. Haqy Asaad, and to people like him.

God Bless and watch over him, as he goes about doing what few would ever consider doing.

With Iraqis like him, the insurgents don't stand a chance.

Cheers All,

Bill1

-- July 20, 2005 4:10 PM ∞

---

Ziarian wrote:

Sara :
the Purpose of the statistics of rape is to show that the black sheeps are everywhere in the world in muslim society and also in westren society.

Thanks
Ziarian

-- July 20, 2005 4:13 PM ∞

---

johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Hello my beloved brothers and sisters. Greetings from the triangle . Hello to my brothers carl and SGT,

So what is the lastest speculation on this dinar. When is the next date for the PEG?

-- July 20, 2005 8:07 PM ∞

---

Sara Madgid wrote:

Iraqi charter almost ready despite setbacks
Compiled by Daily Star staff
Thursday, July 21, 2005

Iraq announced its post-Saddam Hussein constitution would be ready within two weeks despite sustained rebel attacks that saw the killing of two Sunni members of the charter's drafting committee and the subsequent resignation of another four.

In Iraq, constitution committee chairman Hamoun Hammadi said the document would be ready to go to Parliament by August 1, ahead of the August 15 deadline, before going to a referendum on October 15.

"There has been an agreement about all the basic issues, including the basic principles, rights, duties and freedoms," he told reporters. "The only point left is that of federalism which aroused some concerns and fears."

The national assembly will then debate the draft and submit amendments in time for a final vote on August 15, marking a milestone in Iraq's political transition following the March 2003 U.S.-led invasion and the toppling of Saddam.

A three-minute silence was observed to commemorate the deaths of 32 children in Baghdad last week when a suicide bomber blew himself up as U.S. soldiers handed out chocolates and for the 83 dead when another bomber blew up a propane gas tanker in Al-Musayyib, south of the capital.

The terrorists "feel that by killing our children we will bow down," Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari told Parliament in a televised broadcast, flanked by his cabinet ministers.

"But the people of Iraq have faced a dictatorial regime for three decades and they will not bow down."

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=10&categ_id=2&article_id=16958

-- July 20, 2005 8:07 PM ∞

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Sara Madgid wrote:

Ziarian;

Thank you for making clear what the purpose of the rape statistics was.
I agree.. there are bad people in every country.
I am very satisfied with your kind and tolerant viewpoints.
Thank you for your posts and understanding/enlightenment.

Bill1;

Amen to that! :)

Sara.

-- July 20, 2005 8:16 PM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Carl you are talking about me again. You just mention me in your last post. Who died and made you president of this board. I thought we were best friends but i see that you are still talking about me. I did not mean for you to take our break up so serious. I thought we were still friends and we could put the past behind us.

If you will like i can send meatgrinder the pictures of you and i and SGT all hanging out.

-- July 20, 2005 8:53 PM ∞

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RON wrote:

Hello all
Carl the post you just made about the disrespect of other people,is truth and it needs to be read by all.In Iraq there will be alot of things that will be connected to the dinar,therefore it is all needed so we as the NID GANG can chew on it and get our own thoughts about the way it may concern the dinar.Thanks to all for your input,and the train will be here one day.
Good luck to all and Iraq.Ron

-- July 20, 2005 9:05 PM ∞

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SGT at SPOD wrote:

"For those who trys to bash me for my opianions great. For the ones that thinks i did not serve, i have not a low life. US NAVY 1976-2001 Retired Chief . So brothers and sister when some of you all was still in grade school , I stood the watch over america. I sail the seas and i protected freedom . I stood the watch oversea so the enemy while not come to our shore as some of you all are doing today. Go bash on the low lifes that want freedom with out making any sacrfice for this country and freedom they enjoy.

Comment by johnnyhavedinar at July 2, 2005 12:58 PM | Permalink"

JHD,

First, Your'e a Retired Navy Chief......NOW a SSG! I wonder if anything you've said has any truth at all to it...........

S at S

-- July 21, 2005 1:25 AM ∞

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riddler wrote:

hiw true is this

What Recall? How come nobody told me?

Most countries that go through revolutions, major government changes, inflation or wars are forced to change their currency, issue new notes, drop zeros and even change the name of the currency. As a Paper Money dealer for over 20 years, I have seen this happen in Afghanistan, Iran, Russia, ex-Soviet, Argentina, Mexico and other countries.
There is no question that sometime in the future (maybe 2007-8) the Iraqi Government will issue a set of new banknotes. The paper money in circulation now, which is also known as the “Bremer Dinar", is associated with the Coalition Forces and the USA, and will be changed by the new Iraqi Government.
When the Central Bank of Iraq issues the new currency, it will allow a short period of time for the Iraqis to exchange the "Bremer Dinars" with the New Dinars. The Central Bank of Iraq IS NOT RESPONSIBLE for your investment, and unless you can rush your Dinars to a bank in Iraq, they will be worthless. While the Central Bank of Iraq gave 3 months for its citizens to exchange Saddam's banknotes with the new ones, THERE IS NO GUARANTEE that they will allow an extended time period next time.
Again; those of us who have been in the Paper Money business for years, remember how Iran allowed only one week for the “Shah’s” banknotes to be exchanged with those of the Islamic Republic. During this one-week all postal deliveries came to a halt thus billions of Rials, which had left the country, were never returned and became worthless. Even though 25 years have passed since the Revolution in Iran, you still CAN NOT take the Iranian Rial to your local bank or Western Union to exchange with US$.
copied from mebanknotes.com

-- July 21, 2005 2:43 AM ∞

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johnnyhavedinar wrote:

Carl my good friend, who died and made you king of this board. I have not disrespect you but you felt it was in your best interest to callmy name.

However we are still friendsand i can send or post a copy of the pictures with you and and and Sgt.

I will still love you guys. Peace love and how about thatdead dinar pegging.

-- July 21, 2005 12:59 PM ∞

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Albert wrote:

Could anyone comment about this. Thoughts anyone????

**I do not wish to undermine the eBay sellers with this information, but rather add another avenue or two to the Dinar speculation.** If you want more paper currency (I bent-over for 2 million), I would recommend buying smaller denominations 50s, 250s, 500s, and 1,000s. Everyone is beginning to “dump” their 25,000 notes as there would be no possible use for these (except maybe large commercial transactions) if the Dinar really escalated in value. Last month, there were about 85 Dinar eBay auctions running and now there are over 400 (most 25,000 notes) on any given day, and keep in mind that the amount of Dinar available has not increased, so people are dumping.

Also another thing i got this from

AboutDinar.com, Iraqi Dinars View topic - Chairman of Al-Warka bank arrested

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/27/international/27iraq.html

"In arrests that highlighted rising sectarian tension, Sunni businessmen said Thursday, five or six wealthy Sunnis had been seized over the past two weeks. One man, Saad al-Bunnia, chairman of the Iraqi Bank Association and chairman of Al Warka Bank, was taken from his home in Baghdad on Sunday by Iraqi and American soldiers, who also seized $6 million from a safe in his home.

The ministers 'announced that this money belonged to insurgents,' said Hathal Aga, the bank's vice chairman, 'but it's actually bank money and we can prove it.' It was not clear if this $6 million was the money the two ministers referred to as having been seized in raids."

Even if this turns out that the $6 million is the "Banks money" what was he doing keeping it at his home. I for one would not want the Chairman of Bank of America keeping my money at his home. Good luck to all with Al Warka accounts.

This is the Iraq bank that 100's of unsuspecting naive 'investors' have been sending Thousands (millions) of USD to in hopes of making a killing in the ISX and rising value of the NID

If the above is true then I want to know how o open a bank account from awaka banks .i found this post from an email I recieved. Was wondering if this was true or not.

****BANK ACCOUNT INFO.
To open a bank account, you need a photo ID (with your address and signature) and also to form a letter (see below) requesting that an account be opened for you. 1)You need to type the letter. 2) Print it out. 3) Sign it. 4) Scan and save as a jpeg. 5) Scan and save ID as jpeg. Once this is done, attach them to an email and send a copy to the 2nd of these addresses with a subject like “Please open new account”:

For any question or information you need to ask about, send your e-mails to :
Info@warkainvestmentbank.com

For any documents you need to send to open an account, send your e-mails to :
c.accounts@warkainvestmentbank.com

For any requests for services like exchanging , bank statements, stocks ,etc., send your e-mails to :
c.services@warkainvestmentbank.com

Example of LETTER :

I, Xxxx X. Xxxxxxxx, authorize Al-Warka Investment Bank to draw from my U.S. Dollar account (current or savings) in the above Bank and exchange the U.S. Dollar into Iraq Dinar according to the price fixed by the Central Bank of Iraq at that day, and deposit it into my Iraqi Dinar account at the said bank.

Xxxx X. Xxxxx (name & address typed) ***and after you print-out, sign, then scan and send.***
123 Maple Lane
Hooterville, Virginia. 329XX

With everyone sending emails w/files attached, it eats up a lot of space on the other end and responses were averaging 4-7 days in September of 2004 when I set-up my account…Patience is a virtue here!!! OR You may now send a request by mail: Below are two emails re: sending documentation via FedEx.

I also asked USPS and they do mail to Iraq (Priority International)

November 23, 2004

Dear Miss Randda B. Al-Shakir,

I wish to open both an Iraqi Dinar savings account and a USD savings
account with Al-Warka Investment Bank.

I need to transmit my authorization letters and copy of my driver’s
license to you.

1. Will you accept delivery via FedEx?
May I mail my authorization letters and a copy of my driver’s license
to you via FedEx?

I prefer mailing documentation to you rather than using email.

3. What mailing address goes directly to you?
Do I mail to:

Warka Investment Bank
Head Office
Baghdad - Iraq
Hay Alwihda - Sec. 902 - 14th St.

Will this work anyone??????????

The best time to send is on a Tuesday or Wednesday at about 11:30p.m. EST, as Iraq is 8 hours ahead of the U.S. your email will arrive during their business hours. Their weekend days are also different from ours (Friday-Saturday, rather than Saturday and Sunday). You will receive a response from Miss Randda B. Al-Shakir with your account numbers, one for USD and one for Iraq Dinar. She will also send info. on how to wire funds from your bank. Currently, you must use an intermediary bank (99% of us have used Housing Bank for Trade & Finance (Amman, Jordan). Their (Housing bank) fee is $38.11 USD to handle the transaction. Randda will email you when your money is received and let you know your balances. It is FREE to open an account with Warka and it will remain open for 6-months with NO $$ in it, so you will have some time to research more if you desire. The USD account will earn 3% interest and the Dinar account is currently 6%. Therefore, on 1,000,000 Dinar, you earn 60,000 Dinar a year (compounding)!!! Imagine if it gets to a good rate, just have the interest converted and wired back every couple months  The current exchange rate can be monitored at many sites, I gave you one previously, here are some more:
http://finance.yahoo.com/currency/convert?from=USD&to=IQD&amt=1&t=1y
http://www.xe.com/ucc/
http://www.trackiraq.com/default.asp

****STOCK MARKET INFO.

Once your accounts are funded and Dinar converted, you can send Randda your picks for the ISX (Iraq Stock Exchange) if you wish to participate. It is not open to foreign investors at this time; but you are beating the rush as your picks will already be in the hands of a Warka trader the day it opens!!! Your Dinar remains in your account until then earning that interest. Also, just pennies will keep your USD account open as there are not fees being taken at this time like a U.S. Bank!!! A stock request letter would be formed (see below) and again print-out, add signature, and scan/attach to email:

ATTENTION : Date 9-26-04
Miss Randda B. Al-Shakir
IRD (International Relations Department)
Al-Warka Bank

I, ****** ____________________ Authorize Warka Bank to withdraw funds from my current Iraq Dinar Account #
For stock purchases of listed companies the same day that Foreign investors are permitted to purchase stocks on the ISX .

Stocks I wish to purchase when available for trade to the Foreign Public are as follows:
Each company listed below I want to buy 50,000 dinars worth of stock in each company.
1. stock # 10032 Kerbala Industries = 50,000 dinars
2. stock # 10028 Iraqi Petrochemicals = 50,000. dinars
3. stock # 31003 Ishtar Hotel = 50,000 dinars
4. stock # 31011 Baghdad for transports = 50,000 dinars
5. stock # 11008 Alkindi for Inoculations = 50,000
6. stock # 11017 Modern Paints = 50,000 dinars
7. stock # 11005 Chemical Products = 50,000 dinars
8. stock # 11001 Baghdad soda = 50,000 dinars
9. stock # 11025 Clothe Finished Products = 50,000 dinars
10. stock # 11004 Light Products = 50,000 dinars
11. stock # 10015 Almansoor for Medicine = 50,000 dinars

Total invested in dinars = 550,000 dinars

Each of the following companies listed below I want to purchase 75,000 dinars worth of stock for each company listed below:
1. stock # 40002 Baghdad Bank = 75,000 dinars
2. stock # 20012 Certified Seeds = 75,000 dinars
3. stock # 31009 Baghdad Hotel = 75,000 dinars
4. stock # 31020 Transport Oil Products and ??? = 75,000 dinars

Total invested in dinars = 300,000 dinars

* Grand total of invested dinars = 850,000 dinars *

The balance of dinars please allow 2,000 dinars in the current account and the remaining dinars into the Savings Account #.

Thank you Miss Randda for your time and attention to the customer needs. Please send return statement with all the current balances for each account . If there are any problems or questions please contact me ASAP and I'll respond ASAP. Thank you again.
Best regards,
Mr. ******

-- July 21, 2005 4:27 PM ∞

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Kevin Brancato wrote:

Folks, this post is closed. The thread continues here.

Here's a list of Dinar posts so far:

1) June 16, 2004 - June 27, 2004
2) June 27, 2004 - November 6, 2004
3) November 6, 2004 - April 11, 2005
4) April 11, 2005 - June 22, 2005
5) June 22, 2005 - July 22, 2005
6) July 22, 2005 - ....

-- July 22, 2005 4:55 PM ∞